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Soldered or Welded Carbine Magazines

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David Albert View Drop Down
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    Posted: Oct 19 2019 at 5:04pm
I posted this photo in the Carbine Photo of the Day thread, but there were no comments made about the magazine. I think this could be a unique photo, as I do not recall seeing a vintage photo of a soldered or welded magazine.

I'm leaning toward the magazine being soldered, because I think it would be tricky to weld a Carbine magazine. In black and white, the joined magazine area certainly looks shiny, as I would expect soldering would.

So, has anyone ever seen another similar photo? Does anyone have a magazine like this?



Thanks!

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote floydthecat Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Oct 19 2019 at 5:38pm
Certainly doesn't facilitate shooting from prone. Has to be hard on a mag-catch too. 

I had first thought they were attached base-to-base and would be flipped, but it looks more like they are stacked. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote jackp1028 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Oct 19 2019 at 6:07pm
Five or six years ago I acquired an Inland that came with a pair of 30 round magazines soldered together, side by side. At the time I thought it was a pretty awkward setup. Not too practical for target shooting. I was able to separate them but they were badly corroded under a really ugly solder joint, possibly from the acid flux that was used. I cleaned the solder and corrosion off as best I could and hit them with a coat of semigloss black paint. I kept the one that looked the best (see below). I gave the uglier one away.





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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote blackfish Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Oct 19 2019 at 6:17pm
I wonder how well that straight homemade magazine would work given the tapered nature of the cartridge. I mean there's a real good reason why those 30 rounders were "bent".

I remember seeing a picture years ago (almost 10) where someone fused a bunch of 30 round magazines end to end to make a ridiculously long magazine but I can't locate it now
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote David Albert Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Oct 19 2019 at 6:56pm
If I was unclear in my original post, this appears to be two 15 round magazines soldered together to make a higher capacity magazine.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote jackp1028 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Oct 19 2019 at 7:46pm
I've never seen any magazines soldered together in tandem like you described. I agree with Blackfish that they would likely be unreliable due to the tapered cartridges binding in the straight tube. I wonder what kind of spring was used in this application? Perhaps two springs also in tandem.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote painter777 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Oct 19 2019 at 8:22pm
@David,
That's pretty interesting..
It surely looks Soldered and clearly a vintage photo.
I've never seen anything like it, at any time.
Makes you wonder about the spring???
Is it a 30rd mag spring? I don't think it is because There would be no reason to build it.
Some how some way I believe they must have joined 2- 15rd mag springs together to build it...
Maybe they were able to solder 2- 15rd springs together.. not sure how they joined them.
But gotta be 2- 15rd springs, otherwise they'd have just used a stock 30rd mag.

I see the carbine has a rear adj sight, 4 rivet hand guard but still has a early barrel band.
Maybe 30rd mags weren't quite available yet?

I'd give $20 just to see how it was made.
Chances are we'll never see another one.
I wouldn't have gave this one a chance of being seen or believed it was out there........
But there it is.

Again very interesting, Thanks for sharing it... Good Luck finding another !

Charlie-P777

ADD: @JP, Now see your post. I must have been typing my reply as you posted. Pardon my duplicate info.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote David Albert Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Oct 19 2019 at 8:48pm
Thanks for your comments...

I did a 1200 dpi scan of the photo, and here is a closeup of the magazine. I do believe it was soldered.

Maybe two 15 rounder springs could be wired together, and then soldered? I wouldn't think the capacity would be 30, but maybe 25...



David Albert
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote blackfish Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Oct 19 2019 at 9:37pm
A similar fusion to that pictured was actually tried during development of the 30 round carbine magazine. But the pictured magazine is not bent more than 2 degrees. And, without the hardened lugs which came later, likely didn't last too long either.

From "Design and Development of the U.S. Carbine Thirty-Round Magazine" by Frank Iannamico in Small Arms Review (August 2005)

Originally posted by <a href=http://www.smallarmsreview.com/display.article.cfm?idarticles=1838 target=_blank rel=nofollow>www.smallarmsreview.com/display.article.cfm?idarticles=1838</a> www.smallarmsreview.com/display.article.cfm?idarticles=1838 wrote:


In December of 1944, U.S. Army Major Fargo submitted two modified carbine magazines to the Infantry Board. One of the magazines had a thirty-round capacity. This magazine was constructed by welding two standard fifteen-round carbine magazines together. Because of the carbine round’s slightly tapered case, the magazines were joined together at an eleven-degree angle.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote New2brass Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Oct 19 2019 at 9:46pm
magazine like Dave's picture was found and reported by Marty Black in CCNL 203-2. Picture also shows the springs also soldered together.

Mag as mentioned by blackfish was reported in CCLN 254.

I think there were a few earlier reports as well.

Good stuff!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote tenOCEE Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Oct 19 2019 at 11:21pm
Originally posted by jackp1028 jackp1028 wrote:

I've never seen any magazines soldered together in tandem like you described. I agree with Blackfish that they would likely be unreliable due to the tapered cartridges binding in the straight tube. I wonder what kind of spring was used in this application? Perhaps two springs also in tandem.


There are currently done versions in .308. Seems I read there are 5.56 too. I've seen the .308 in person and it was well done.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote Dnikkor Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Oct 21 2019 at 2:31am
Ask and ye shall receive...from a CMP Forum post of mine from 2016.

http://forums.thecmp.org/showthread.php?t=185044
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote jackp1028 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Nov 27 2019 at 7:34pm
Check out this after action report. It mentions "improvised" magazines.

http://s798.photobucket.com/user/karls42/slideshow/PDF%20TEST%20SHOT
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote New2brass Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Nov 25 2023 at 5:22pm

Originally posted by Matt_X Matt_X wrote:


Check out this one on the right in this photo then.  Straight, but looks longer than standard.


direct to image



Here is a cropped and enlarged pic
http://www.uscarbinecal30.com/Forum/uploads/3657/WeldedMag.jpg

Source Life Magazine
American soldiers resting alongside the road near the front lines during the Battle of the Bulge.
Location:Belgium
Date taken:December 1944
Photographer:John Florea
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Marty Black Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Nov 26 2023 at 4:45pm
I had one of those soldered double mags decades ago! Just like the Marine in the initial post (David Albert) and the GI in the recent post (Matt_X and New2brass). I found it in a pile of old parts at a gun show. I wish I knew what I did with it!

I would've bet money that I did an article on it for the Carbine Club newsletter, but I cannot find it in the newsletter index...Well, hell! I know I took B&W photos of it, and I'll look for them...if only to prove that I'm not a complete idiot.

Regards, Marty Black
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote New2brass Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Nov 26 2023 at 5:23pm
Originally posted by New2brass New2brass wrote:

magazine like Dave's picture was found and reported by Marty Black in CCNL 203-2. Picture also shows the springs also soldered together.

Mag as mentioned by blackfish was reported in CCLN 254.

I think there were a few earlier reports as well.

Good stuff!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Marty Black Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Nov 26 2023 at 6:42pm
Well, as incredible as it may sound, I found my pics of the soldered double mag! Pictures are very dark, unfortunately. The two mags were not perfectly aligned, so this contraption was a bit crooked. Well worn, rusty and tarnished, which led me to believe that this was a WWII GI mod, and not the product of some tinkerer in his garage. The top mag was marked circled IU and the bottom mag was UN.

I'll attempt to attach 6 photos. Regards, Marty Black

Ahh, shxx...Dan, why am I not seeing the paperclip icon to attach photos?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote W5USMC Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Nov 26 2023 at 7:01pm
Originally posted by Marty Black Marty Black wrote:

Ahh, shxx...Dan, why am I not seeing the paperclip icon to attach photos?

It is a tree Marty not a paperclip. Wink


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Marty Black Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Nov 26 2023 at 7:12pm
Thanks Wayne! Here goes. I may need more than one reply to get all 6 photos in. Marty B





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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Marty Black Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Nov 26 2023 at 7:16pm
Here are the photos 4-6. Sorry about the awful shadows. I made these pics decades ago. mb

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