Requesting Assistance to Identify Correct Bolt

Gentlemen--

I was advised to come on over here to seek your collective wisdom on an issue. I was doing some handyman work for an old timer, and in the course of conversation we got onto the topic of firearms and shooting. Long story short, he goes off to a closet upstairs and comes back with something to show me. It was a Standard Products carbine. Dry as a bone, with spiderwebs in the bore. Clearly it had not been fired in years. I don't know much about carbines, but I noticed that A) the chamber was filthy (which I scolded him for--he got a grin out of that) and that B) it was missing the bolt, and I asked him where it was. He said he had absolutely no idea. I told him I could find him a bolt online, if he'd like. I said we could get the rifle oiled and greased up proper, and maybe hit the range sometime. He said he'd like that.

So anyway, he hadn't had a bottle of Hoppes in the house in forever, so I knocked it down to pins and gave it a bath for him--and on closer inspection (and a couple hours of internet googling) I'll be damned if this carbine isn't mostly correct. The only part which looks to be incorrect is the AMCO barrel band--and the missing bolt.

Here are some pics:









































The one thing that concerns me is that there is some peening in the front shoulder of the bolt raceway.

I'm wondering if this explains why the bolt is missing.

The area of concern is indicated with the pencil. Sorry the pics are marginal--it's hard to get the light right so you can see what I am talking about.









So anyway--I have a line on a couple Standard Products bolts for him, with various parts numbers on the lug, and I was wondering if anyone could advise me as to what number range I should be looking for.

The carbine serial number is in the 2,181,*** range, and the date on the barrel is 1/44.

Thank you in advance for any information you could share.

All the best.

shadycon wrote: Could this be the results of a bolt failure?

That's the thought I had on the forum in question (ar15.com). The only bolt failure I have any experience with is a friends new production "Inland", the A/O parts clones that the bolt is prone to failure on.

The damage reminded me of that. My friend got a new receiver/rifle since it was under warranty.

I'm hoping someone here with more experience with WWII USGI Carbines can say if that damage is critical enough to scrap the receiver.    

S bolts in with the following numbers have been reported in that serial range6,22,36,42,40,51,

@Eight_Ring here is the link to the" how to videos" posted in this forum.

Painter777--the butt plate is indeed marked S-S3.




No such luck that the peening is a lead build-up. There is a distinct, hard burr.

On a happy note, the camming lug recess in the operating rod looks pristine.

Here are more pics for background.

I tired to show the facets of the burr by altering the light source and changing angle. Sorry if the redundancy is tedious.

















One of the members here was kind enough to share relevant information from a newsletter which documents 2 different serial numbers which bracket this particular carbine, and their corresponding/sequential bolt lot numbers. Which is awesome information to have, but which brought me to an ethical dilemma/decision fork which I'm sure many of you have faced. I'm wrestling with the ethics of "correcting" a rifle that is not in fact "correct". Why not just buy a NOS postwar Underwood bolt? It is arguably a safer design, and has some valid engineering improvements. It's what any GI armorer would have done to repair the rifle--and it avoids mischief (intentional or unintentional) inre: misleading collectors. I'm not sure the old-timer would know the difference--or even care, really. He'd just be happy to have the carbine running again.

It is an interesting conundrum.

It’s a dilemma frequently encountered. Just the bolt won’t correct that carbine. A barrel-band (at least) would be needed. I would clean-up the damage and acquire a good T3 complete bolt to confirm the function. A complete round bolt can usually be had in the $100 range and you can always resell it for what you paid for it. One can always be "looking" for the correct bolt. The carbine will never be correct...only corrected, if one did acquire the correct bolt and barrel-band as well as any other components needed to be deemed correct. I'd see if I could fix it first and then consider correcting it. It's likely going back into the closet it came out of anyway.


Edited by floydthecat - Apr 11 2020 at 7:08am

shadycon wrote: It would be nice if the bolt could be found and see what damage it has...............

I spoke with his nephew, and he is going to poke around a bit, see if he can turn it up. There is some age-related decline in the gentlemen's faculties, and that complicates things. His elderly wife is also scandalized by the notion of gun ownership, so he kind of kept it all on the down low, out of sight out of mind, if you know what I mean.

My guess is that the bolt is set aside with the mags, ammo, and cleaning kit--wherever that all got off to. Maybe the house in Vermont.

I'll hold off on buying a bolt until they're pretty sure it is a lost cause.

Looking forward (and assuming the worst)--what is a good source for shooter-grade mags? Everybody seems to be offering pristine new-in-wrap mags for $30 a pop--surely there are some rangeworthy/dependable 50%-75% finish mags out there (someplace) for a reasonable price?

floydthecat wrote: I’m still trying to figure out just how that happened. Looks like it was purposely done with a punch from the rear, but one would need to have been there to see whatever happened at the time I suppose.

I know what you are saying--I am having a hard time visualizing how the left lug could have been the leading point of the impact forces--but I don't know the carbine. Wouldn't the bolt face have galled before the lug recess?

Inre: mags--unfortunately MA is a ban state, and mags must have been made before 1994, which only leaves USGI as the alternative. $60 for 2 mags isn't going to break the bank--but it would be nicer if it was for 4 mags (lol).

Ahhhh...the dreaded communist state syndrome.