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Reloading tips: primer problem? |
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patrickduis 
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Joined: Jan 12 2016 Location: Netherlands Status: Offline Points: 241 |
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 Posted: Feb 27 2017 at 1:02pm |
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I put the crimp now a tad heavier than halfway using the factory crimp. When I give 2 average force bangs with the unload hammer the bullet comes out of the crimped casing. With the crimp die set to a half turn (light crimp) the bullet came lose after only 1 stroke with the unload hammer......just to be sure I put it a tad heavier.
I'll measure the size after the factory crimp and check it thoroughly. I will also check the loaded cases in the dissassembled barrel. This evening all is very quiet here because of carnival and many folks that are on ski-holiday in Austria. So a perfect evening for reloading 50 more of .30m1. Yesterday I already decapped/resized/flared/cleaned and measured the length of the resized+flared casings for that.
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.30M1: 1943+1944 IBM 3x1943-1944 Inland 1943 Underwood
1918 Springfield 1903 1918 Eddystone M1917 1911A1 Colt & Ithaca S&W Victory 1944 Swiss K31 NVBIW, NVWHT, NVBMB, KNSA member |
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floydthecat
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Joined: Oct 13 2016 Location: Mississippi Status: Offline Points: 1792 |
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Posted: Feb 27 2017 at 2:27pm |
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Sounds nice!
You guys don't measure correctly over there...ha..ha..ha. All you have to do to get mm from inches is multiply 25.4 x the decimal number. .338 inches=8.585mm....
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patrickduis
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Joined: Jan 12 2016 Location: Netherlands Status: Offline Points: 241 |
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Posted: Feb 27 2017 at 4:14pm |
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Haha, don't blame us, blame Napoleon! (Stupid French all the time.........)
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.30M1: 1943+1944 IBM 3x1943-1944 Inland 1943 Underwood
1918 Springfield 1903 1918 Eddystone M1917 1911A1 Colt & Ithaca S&W Victory 1944 Swiss K31 NVBIW, NVWHT, NVBMB, KNSA member |
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floydthecat
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Joined: Oct 13 2016 Location: Mississippi Status: Offline Points: 1792 |
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Posted: Feb 28 2017 at 7:43am |
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I checked the measurements on a few commercial never-fired rounds again last night. The case mouths at the crimp are running .333-.334 on production ammo. If you at-or-above that, I don't think round-creep would be a consideration, unless your chamber is screwed.
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patrickduis
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Posted: Feb 28 2017 at 10:34am |
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I checked a few new PRVI rounds I still have (those without problems) and the crimp is 8.4mm on all of them. Same as when I crimp with the FCD: that also gives 8.4mm consistently.
I tested all rounds inside the barrel and they chamber ok. I feel the rim touching and here the good sound when you let it fall inside the chamber.
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.30M1: 1943+1944 IBM 3x1943-1944 Inland 1943 Underwood
1918 Springfield 1903 1918 Eddystone M1917 1911A1 Colt & Ithaca S&W Victory 1944 Swiss K31 NVBIW, NVWHT, NVBMB, KNSA member |
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floydthecat
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Posted: Feb 28 2017 at 11:13am |
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The spec. is 8.53mm. It's likely most ammo you find would be a little less than that...like 8.45. 8.4 would equate to .331, a little small, but I don't know if small enough to cause a problem and I also realize that measurements are only as good as the tools and the "measurer".
I'm sure you meant that you feel the case-mouth touching? The rim should never touch the breech. It should remain exposed so the extractor can catch it and there will always be a small amount of unsupported section. If you really are pushing the round in enough for it to actually touch the face of the chamber.....there is a problem.
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patrickduis
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Posted: Feb 28 2017 at 11:30am |
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You are right. I feel the case mouth touching with the correct sound. And the rim is exposed well enough for the extractor. I carefully seated each primer with the turret press and now they are seated like they should be.
I'm curious for the results. Next week the range is open again and we will know if the 13.5grs improves the cycling and all primers fire. I noticed that the cases are quite full with 13.5grs v-N110.
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.30M1: 1943+1944 IBM 3x1943-1944 Inland 1943 Underwood
1918 Springfield 1903 1918 Eddystone M1917 1911A1 Colt & Ithaca S&W Victory 1944 Swiss K31 NVBIW, NVWHT, NVBMB, KNSA member |
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floydthecat
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Posted: Feb 28 2017 at 12:31pm |
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13.5 grains of H110 moves a 110-grain FMJ with an OAL of 1.66 at 1857 fps on my chronograph. I'm not familiar with your v-N110. Don't know if that's a relabeled H110 or not?
PS: I went and looked. Looks like the max. load for that N110 is 14-grains. 13.5 should be safe. 12.1 appears to be the starting load.
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patrickduis
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Posted: Mar 06 2017 at 3:48pm |
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Just back from the range. The 13.5grs v-N110 load cycled now without any problem. Only problem is still the primers, so the setting of the primers with the Lee turret press iso the safety prime didn't solve that problem. Still 50% didn't fire and the dents of the firing pin in the ones that fired look exactly the same as the ones that misfired.
Loading the misfired rounds in the magazine and firing them again gave misfires, but with loading them manually one by one I was able to fire a few previously misfired ones. The grouping with 13.5grs v-N110 was awesome kneeled, so for the grouping and cycling this load is definately a keeper. Going to get me some federal primers and test again.
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.30M1: 1943+1944 IBM 3x1943-1944 Inland 1943 Underwood
1918 Springfield 1903 1918 Eddystone M1917 1911A1 Colt & Ithaca S&W Victory 1944 Swiss K31 NVBIW, NVWHT, NVBMB, KNSA member |
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sling00
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Joined: Apr 21 2016 Location: Tennessee Status: Offline Points: 919 |
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Posted: Mar 06 2017 at 4:25pm |
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Sounds like you're on the trail to success. I've not seen it first hand but I have read where different primer brands can make a slight change in the performance of the rounds. Once you get some reliable primers you may need to fine tune the load for optimum performance.
Good luck.
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patrickduis
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Posted: Mar 10 2017 at 8:48am |
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Got me a box of Federal small rifle primers and S&B brass..........what already astonishes me, is that the brass is 32.70mm length whereas the PRVI (which I succesfully shot in my carbine) has approx 32.55mm length.....
My armourer said that the Federal primers are a bit softer, so that can maybe help. Reloaded 10 rounds with re-used PRVI brass and Federal primers, 15 rounds with new S&B brass and Federal primers and 10 rounds with S&B brass and S&B primers. The seating depth of both the Federal and S&B primers in both the PRVI and S&B brass was for my feeling slightly too deep. Seated them with the very convenient Lee Safety primer. Next monday I'm going to test these rounds at the range and we will know more (or the same.....)
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.30M1: 1943+1944 IBM 3x1943-1944 Inland 1943 Underwood
1918 Springfield 1903 1918 Eddystone M1917 1911A1 Colt & Ithaca S&W Victory 1944 Swiss K31 NVBIW, NVWHT, NVBMB, KNSA member |
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floydthecat
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Posted: Mar 10 2017 at 9:03am |
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I certainly don't consider myself much above a Journeyman re-loader, but I have pumped-out thousands.
Maybe my equipment, maybe my technique or just me period, but I have never loaded a primer too deep. I am a one-pass-at-a-time loader and have never used anything progressive or automatic. My tools seat the primer flush with the rim and I've never tried to make one go any deeper.
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sling00
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Joined: Apr 21 2016 Location: Tennessee Status: Offline Points: 919 |
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Posted: Mar 10 2017 at 9:55am |
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Yep, I've reloaded bunches as well, mainly 38 spl , 357 mag and 44 mag. I use to do hunting loads for my 30-06 but haven't attempted that in at least 25 yrs or more. I have a RCBS Rock Chucker and just always seat the primers firmly one at a time as well. I don't recall any problems with them too deep. I have had a few flip up sideways and even upside down, and go unnoticed until after I seated them. That is usually an exciting discovery. Fortunately none went bang but I did close my eyes and turn my back when I de-primed the case.
I look forward to seeing how your new primers work out. Keep us posted and have a good weekend.
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patrickduis
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Posted: Mar 13 2017 at 4:14pm |
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Just back from the range and had a wonderful evening with many .30m1 shots, what a dream rifle it is!
The PRVI cases of about 32.5-32.6mm length with the Federal primers all fired well (10 pieces) The longer brand new S&B cases of about 32.7mm length with the S&B primers also fired well (10 pieces) After that I fired about 40 pcs that were previously loaded with the short 32.5-32.6mm PRVI cases and the S&B primers. About half of them fired well but the other ones I needed to fire 2x and even 3 pcs 3x. But I was able to fire them all. So, the combination of a relatively short case of 32.5-32.6mm and a relatively hard S&B primer caused the misfires. I'm going to stick with the PRVI cases with Federal primers. The armourer told me I could give the unused box with S&B primers back. Tomorrow I'm going to load a few again for the next test and in the evening I'm going to fire the other PRVI case+S&B primer cartridges that I have left. It is a very good training that you fire and are not sure if there comes a bang or not. This shows anticipated movement (lucky for me there was none, haha). |
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.30M1: 1943+1944 IBM 3x1943-1944 Inland 1943 Underwood
1918 Springfield 1903 1918 Eddystone M1917 1911A1 Colt & Ithaca S&W Victory 1944 Swiss K31 NVBIW, NVWHT, NVBMB, KNSA member |
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floydthecat
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Posted: Mar 13 2017 at 4:50pm |
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Always good to hear success stories. Now we know why ammo is 26 Euros over there.....you keep shooting it all up...
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sling00
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Joined: Apr 21 2016 Location: Tennessee Status: Offline Points: 919 |
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Posted: Mar 13 2017 at 5:31pm |
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That's great news! And not a single flinch on the mis-fires...impressive. :)
I am glad you've got it figured out.
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patrickduis
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Posted: Mar 13 2017 at 6:07pm |
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Yeah.....when you hear "click", especially in the standing position......when you are very concentrated, is not nice. The carbine is clean again and tomorrow I'll shoot the other box of "maybe yes, maybe no" rounds......from then on I can make nice carbine ammo myself.
I noticed that with reloading it is that you either like or dislike it. I like it a lot and it is an expansion of the shooting sport hobby. It feels really good when you get excellent results with ammo that you made yourself.
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.30M1: 1943+1944 IBM 3x1943-1944 Inland 1943 Underwood
1918 Springfield 1903 1918 Eddystone M1917 1911A1 Colt & Ithaca S&W Victory 1944 Swiss K31 NVBIW, NVWHT, NVBMB, KNSA member |
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sling00
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Joined: Apr 21 2016 Location: Tennessee Status: Offline Points: 919 |
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Posted: Mar 14 2017 at 7:17am |
Yes it does. Definitely a sense of accomplishment. Somewhat similar to tying your own fishing lures and actually catching a fish with it. |
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patrickduis
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Posted: Mar 21 2017 at 4:45pm |
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Shot about 30 rounds with the Federal primers again: not a single misfire so these Federal primers definately solved the problem.
Still shooting a tad high, so I will reduce the load from 13.5grs N110 to 13.0grs and try to get spot on again.
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.30M1: 1943+1944 IBM 3x1943-1944 Inland 1943 Underwood
1918 Springfield 1903 1918 Eddystone M1917 1911A1 Colt & Ithaca S&W Victory 1944 Swiss K31 NVBIW, NVWHT, NVBMB, KNSA member |
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sling00
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Posted: Mar 22 2017 at 4:30am |
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That was an interesting discussion. I'm glad it ended up being a relatively simple fix as well as a lesson for others regarding primer reliability. Definitely something to keep in mind.
Best regards
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patrickduis wrote: