Click on the image above to learn more about the M1 Carbine
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pulling out what little hair I have left. |
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blackfish ![]() On Point ![]() ![]() Joined: Mar 30 2016 Location: 999-0 Status: Offline Points: 287 |
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OK I'll take SPRINGS for $0.02 since I don't think that M2 receiver steel could have been worn down like that by a much softer material like copper even after thousands of rounds. But since I don't have my drawings with me, I can't really be sure. But since hand cycling "works" and "live" cycling doesnt ...
When was the last time you checked your magazine spring(s)? There's a right way and a wrong way to install them. Needless to say, the wrong orientation will function very poorly. How is your magazine spring oriented inside the magazine? You can't just stuff it in and close the end. SIDE VIEW OF SPRING (breech is on the left and muzzle on the right) \ / \ / The "arrowheads" point in direction of bullet travel when correctly installed If this is not revealing, get a known-to-be-good USGI mag (lots have been wrecked by end-user "tweaking" so BORROW one your eyes and ears tell you is functional at your range). See if that helps. |
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Bubba-7 ![]() Recruit ![]() Joined: Mar 06 2016 Location: Columbus, Ga. Status: Offline Points: 49 |
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After all you have done, I would check the gas nut to see if it is the late style. While it is out, I would size the gas port and be sure it is at least 0.070" dia. Then clean it.
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David Milisock ![]() On Point ![]() ![]() Joined: Aug 03 2019 Location: USA Status: Offline Points: 314 |
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I'm posting a few images of my feed ramps and then one of a magazine comparison. It's fairly clear to me that the feed ramp on my Inland has been polished at one time. The darker feed ramp is from my Quality Hardware Carbine, both feed flawlessly.
The only cycling issues I have had in the past were due to improper cold weather preparation methods and or underperforming ammunition. After resolving these issues the only other cycling issues I have had have been due to the unfortunate aspect of purchasing improperly manufacture or stored magazines. ![]() ![]() ![]() |
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David Milisock
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David Milisock ![]() On Point ![]() ![]() Joined: Aug 03 2019 Location: USA Status: Offline Points: 314 |
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Ok here are the mag pictures, both mags as you see them pictured work in both carbines flawlessly. The magazine on the right as you can see has a vastly different right ear (that's right as you see them) I'm posting a second image with a red line accenting the ear angles. I am of the opinion that I would make sure that the ammo is viable, then look at the magazines ears, the springs, not just the magazine springs but the recoil spring, check the gas port and piston and clean the rifle very well removing grease and oil for testing.
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David Milisock
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oldfart69 ![]() On Point ![]() Joined: Apr 07 2019 Location: Washington Status: Offline Points: 46 |
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I will try to find some, so, what are good sources?
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THE oldfart69
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David Milisock ![]() On Point ![]() ![]() Joined: Aug 03 2019 Location: USA Status: Offline Points: 314 |
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Part of the receiver
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David Milisock
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David Milisock ![]() On Point ![]() ![]() Joined: Aug 03 2019 Location: USA Status: Offline Points: 314 |
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The magazine I show on the right had to have the right ear opened up just a tiny bit. I show it already repaired, but before it was repaired it failed in both my rifles. BTW I never slam a magazine home when placing it in the rifle.
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David Milisock
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W5USMC ![]() Moderator Group ![]() ![]() Joined: Apr 29 2017 Location: Missouri Status: Offline Points: 2737 |
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Seller 81mm on gunbroker usually has some USGI mags for sale, also J&G sales has some that are new old stock with a choice of Mfg. https://www.jgsales.com/m1-carbine-15rd-surplus-magazine,-original-usgi,-nice-blued-condition,-with-choice-of-mfg-available.-p-402.html?osCsid=f3c8e944f4eec07fdf32c0606c45b68c |
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Wayne
USMC Retired NRA Life Member |
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oldfart69 ![]() On Point ![]() Joined: Apr 07 2019 Location: Washington Status: Offline Points: 46 |
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OK, thanks. 1. This is an m1 not an m2, it is a plainfield commercial type made somewhere between 1963 and 1976. 2. 4 of the 5 mags I have are nib 2 are 10 round and 2 are 15 rounds the 15's are auto-ordnance, the 10's are unknown but new. I have one 20 round that came with with rifle of unknown age and use (it has the hold open follower). 3 I am including a new photo I just found of a different plainfield than mine it was found on either this site or a sister forum. Virtually, it is identical to mine except for the shine. Wednesday, my friend who has a steering gear ww2 m1 will allow me to use his trigger group in my rifle just to eliminate another part group. hoping soon I can quit pestering all of you good guys, I am also asking my friend to bring his Us army tech guide which has detailed measurements. sigh. ![]() |
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THE oldfart69
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floydthecat ![]() Hard Corps ![]() Joined: Oct 13 2016 Location: Mississippi Status: Offline Points: 1792 |
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Over the course of the past few days, I have had the opportunity to gut a 41xxx Plainfield and a 5.5 Winnie. The Winnie is a mix-master and I cant’t swear it was never in M2 dress. However, the feed ramp in both receivers closely resemble the one here in question. I think it is highly likely that oldfart’s has been polished though....severely.
Plainfield barrels are skirtless and maybe the ramps were machined this way to improve feeding.....maybe. In any event, based in what I see and what OP says he saw at the range, this could obviously be the norm for Plainfield. This Plainfield I have here in my hands has never been disassembled. I need to add that after a tune-up and cleaning, both these guns run flawlessly with any magazine I shove in.
Edited by floydthecat - Aug 31 2019 at 1:58pm |
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David Albert ![]() Hard Corps ![]() ![]() Status Quo Challenger Joined: Dec 27 2015 Location: Ohio Status: Offline Points: 1002 |
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Definitely try some USGI magazines. 90% of the time, problems like you mention are the result of magazine issues. If Kahr/AO Carbine magazines are anything like most Kahr/AO Thompson drums, I would eliminate them as a factor while troubleshooting your Carbine issues.
David Albert dalbert@sturmgewehr.com |
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NRA Life Member
Past Pres., The American Thompson Association Amer. Society of Arms Collectors OGCA/TCA/Carbine Club/GCA/IAA SAR Writer Author - The Many Firearm Designs of Eugene Reising Eagle Scout |
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oldfart69 ![]() On Point ![]() Joined: Apr 07 2019 Location: Washington Status: Offline Points: 46 |
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I have tried my friends usgi mags and they act the same as my new ones. What does a tuneup consist of? When I got it, I replaced the recoil spring and guide, the ejector and extractor, the forog pin and all assorted parts. I cleaned the bolt in an ultrasonic cleaner with simple green. I lubed per the us army tech manual. All parts move smoothly and look appropriate. I can cycle rounds without firing and they all load and eject properly that way, but not when shot. I have fired new factory loads from remington, winchester and aquila , I have also fired my own hand loads using once fired brass from this firearm excluding any that did not cycle properly. I also put my friends entire lower trigger group in my rifle and shot with it as well with marrginally (maybe my imagination) better. That is all the news this afternoon.
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THE oldfart69
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blackfish ![]() On Point ![]() ![]() Joined: Mar 30 2016 Location: 999-0 Status: Offline Points: 287 |
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This is the way to troubleshoot your issue(s). Start with your barrelled receiver. Then assemble *all* of your friends parts onto it. You know his/her's works right? Does your's now work? If the problem is not "fixed", it lies with your barrelled receiver to wit check your barrel alignment to the receiver. If function is significantly better then you can start putting your parts back into the mix, one part at a time until badness reappears. |
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tenOCEE ![]() Hard Corps ![]() ![]() Knows rear sights! Joined: Jan 01 2016 Location: East Tenn Status: Offline Points: 1328 |
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Found my early Plainfield picture of the feed ramp. This was made in 1964ish. |
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floydthecat ![]() Hard Corps ![]() Joined: Oct 13 2016 Location: Mississippi Status: Offline Points: 1792 |
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I think all of us have pretty much demonstrated the Plainfield ramps were finished in this manner. I also think we can agree that OP’s has been polished...severely. Probably done because it may have had feeding issues from the get-go. Plainfield barrels are not skirted... maybe that aggravates things, but I have two un-skirted barrels in guns that function just fine. I have read where it could have been an issue. If the bolt does not properly seat it could cause extraction issues. *all* means change the bolt also.
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W5USMC ![]() Moderator Group ![]() ![]() Joined: Apr 29 2017 Location: Missouri Status: Offline Points: 2737 |
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But what about this picture, it does not look like it was finished the same way. Is it possible that Plainfield used "soft metal" for their receivers that actually wore down after many rounds down range? ![]() |
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Wayne
USMC Retired NRA Life Member |
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tenOCEE ![]() Hard Corps ![]() ![]() Knows rear sights! Joined: Jan 01 2016 Location: East Tenn Status: Offline Points: 1328 |
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Mistakes are made as soon as one states that something has been proven and accepted when it comes to things such as the Carbine, doesn't it?. I still learn such in my own experience. Patterns can be interpreted along a common time line and perhaps that's good enough. Look at the Universal discussion where it was suggested that after a certain serial that there should be no defects that like what were shown in two examples in a tight serial range where they weren't thought to exist. On the Plainfield example I posted you can see what appears to be a cursory shaping with (what I'm assuming is) a rotary tool. It doesn't show finely polished metal, but that barrel swallowed a muzzle gauge completely to the hilt, so it was shot to death. "Shot out" in it's definition. But it functioned flawlessly if the magazine was true. The ramps are something I'll be looking at when I see them locally at shows, along with looking for cracked Universal top rails in the 400,000 serial range-in all ranges actually.
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painter777 ![]() Hard Corps ![]() ![]() Joined: Feb 18 2016 Location: Central MI Status: Offline Points: 1618 |
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I agree with all the input. Ramp is one of the roughest most distorted I've ever seen.
But.... with him being able to hand cycle with NO issues. I'd follow up on the advice from Roger M and make sure the Gas Cylinder is clear. If restricted it could be killing the energy the carbine relies on 'After the shot'. Easy enough to check. Good Luck, Charlie-P777 ADD: Also look for Burrs on the inside rails the bolt lugs track on.
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Living Free because of those that serve.....
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oldfart69 ![]() On Point ![]() Joined: Apr 07 2019 Location: Washington Status: Offline Points: 46 |
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Where can I find some instructions on how to clear it? Youtube? somewhere else. thanks a million pk
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THE oldfart69
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W5USMC ![]() Moderator Group ![]() ![]() Joined: Apr 29 2017 Location: Missouri Status: Offline Points: 2737 |
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k99HPXZMmrc |
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Wayne
USMC Retired NRA Life Member |
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