The Carbine Collectors Club

Click on the image above to learn more about the M1 Carbine


Forum Home Forum Home > The Club > Safety/ Accuracy/Shooting/Ammunition/Care and Maintenance
  New Posts New Posts
  FAQ FAQ  Forum Search   Register Register  Login Login


Piston Nut Staking

 Post Reply Post Reply
Author
Message
floydthecat View Drop Down
Hard Corps
Hard Corps


Joined: Oct 13 2016
Location: Mississippi
Status: Offline
Points: 915
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote floydthecat Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Topic: Piston Nut Staking
    Posted: Sep 16 2019 at 5:14pm
How odd is it to find a piston nut never staked? I have a Rock barreled action with an Underwood barrel, obviously a rebuild. It has a spanking new nut and piston installed, I am sure never fired since it was installed. I can find no evidence of any previous staking. The gas cylinder is integral to the barrel, so it has to be original.
Back to Top
painter777 View Drop Down
Hard Corps
Hard Corps
Avatar

Joined: Feb 18 2016
Location: Central MI
Status: Offline
Points: 656
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote painter777 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Sep 16 2019 at 6:17pm
Hi Floyd,
The other day Dan dug up a copy/link to a PS Magazine to show me. We were going on about proper Oiler install.
In the link there was a 1961 dated page that pointed out that as of then it was ok under the right circumstances that a GI could remove, clean and replace the gas piston on his own instead of having to have it done by the Armorer-Artificer.
As long as it really needed cleaning the GI could do so if they followed the new procedure.
Basically using the proper wrench and tightening just past finger tight.
It called for NO MORE STAKING.
Maybe yours falls in to this 1961 or later time frame ?

I'll try posting the illustrations and the page link.

HTH,
Charlie-P777



NO MORE STAKING:



For More Tips Follow The Link to:
PS Magazine, a Postscript to technical manuals and other published maintenance guidance done in a comic book style.....


ETA: Credit to Newsman1 for the Article
Living Free because of those that serve.....
Back to Top
floydthecat View Drop Down
Hard Corps
Hard Corps


Joined: Oct 13 2016
Location: Mississippi
Status: Offline
Points: 915
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote floydthecat Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Sep 16 2019 at 6:31pm
I did not acquire the action for the barrel, but for the receiver to do a build. The action has been re-parked and it’s solid. Good to hear that somebody may have actually been following instructions by not staking it. Looks to me like the original nut was never staked. This is a 6.08 early 44-ish receiver. I went to my Fred Sanford drawer full of spectacles and never did find a pair that indicated staking-tracks on the cylinder.
Back to Top
painter777 View Drop Down
Hard Corps
Hard Corps
Avatar

Joined: Feb 18 2016
Location: Central MI
Status: Offline
Points: 656
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote painter777 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Sep 16 2019 at 7:24pm
Fresh nut and piston are a good thing.At Least you know there are no problems there, like the examples below.
I've handled 3 carbines for friends that were ruined @ the gas piston/gas cylinder. All bought (for too much $$ ) at farm/estate auctions far from home.
2 had the gas cylinders badly cracked. The last one the nut was wasted... looking like they had tried to remove it with channel locks. Inner threads were so bad we couldn't chase them to recover. 2 received different barrels, the other had the owner so pizzed off he bent the barrel over his knee in to a U shape. I just recently sold that receiver for him. A WRA last style spring tube 1,126,xxx. I wish I could have got a picture of that bent barrel..... reminded you of a secret prototype that could shoot around corners. It would have looked comical but he wasn't in a joking mood. Him being a ex Pro NBA player @ 6'10" it wasn't like I could take it from him. He tossed it in the back of his pick up as he was leaving.
BTW those barrels bend easier than I would have thought.

Good luck on your build,
Charlie-P777
Living Free because of those that serve.....
Back to Top
floydthecat View Drop Down
Hard Corps
Hard Corps


Joined: Oct 13 2016
Location: Mississippi
Status: Offline
Points: 915
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote floydthecat Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Sep 16 2019 at 8:02pm
I am not in the collector class, the shooter class. I was not looking for a Rock-Ola action, but it presented itself at a price well below what I’ve seen barreled actions go for, especially the scarce ones.
Back to Top
Dirty30Carbine View Drop Down
Recruit
Recruit
Avatar

Joined: Aug 24 2019
Location: Chester
Status: Offline
Points: 25
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Dirty30Carbine Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Sep 16 2019 at 9:39pm
why does it seem that so many rockola were rearsenalled with Underwood barrels? I have one, you have one, I’ve seen probably 5-6 others. 
Justan C McKinney
JCMcKinney308@gmail.com
Back to Top
m1a1fan View Drop Down
Hard Corps
Hard Corps
Avatar
Got Para?

Joined: Jan 01 2016
Location: Virginia
Status: Online
Points: 1661
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote m1a1fan Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Sep 16 2019 at 10:06pm
Underwood was quite the barrel maker and rebuilder of carbines.

Back to Top
floydthecat View Drop Down
Hard Corps
Hard Corps


Joined: Oct 13 2016
Location: Mississippi
Status: Offline
Points: 915
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote floydthecat Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Sep 17 2019 at 4:40am
This being a BR only, I don’t have a stock that could speak about where it’s been. After my 3rd or 4th. cup of coffee this morning, I may get a picture of the piston and sight staking. If this receiver ever had a flip on it, it was never staked. It wears an I.R. CO T3 rear with one perfect punch in the right front corner.

As with the Underwood barrels I have had, dates are hit-n-miss. All I see is a 4 and I’m not real sure what position it’s in.
Back to Top
bumppo View Drop Down
Recruit
Recruit
Avatar

Joined: Jul 12 2020
Location: canada
Status: Offline
Points: 11
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote bumppo Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Jul 27 2020 at 9:40pm
   as i was cleaning my first M1 carbine for the first time since acquiring it a month ago, i noticed the gas cylinder nut was loose. it rotated freely when i passed a brush over it.
   i'd fired a hundred rounds from this gun in the week prior with only three cycling failures.
   the nut turned out easily using fingers only until the last two threads, which were hard to turn with my fingers at the same point in each rotation. i cleaned the nut, piston and cylinder and photographed the nut before threading it back into place. I tightened it finger tight and then tapped one of the indents with a wooden stick.
   as the photo shows, two of the indents were already in a seriously damaged condition.
   i haven't fired the gun yet since reassembling it. 
  
Back to Top
bumppo View Drop Down
Recruit
Recruit
Avatar

Joined: Jul 12 2020
Location: canada
Status: Offline
Points: 11
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote bumppo Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Jul 27 2020 at 9:49pm
here is the nut back in position:
Back to Top
bumppo View Drop Down
Recruit
Recruit
Avatar

Joined: Jul 12 2020
Location: canada
Status: Offline
Points: 11
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote bumppo Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Jul 27 2020 at 10:05pm
it was only as I was posting the last photo that I noticed the cylinder is damaged too at the rim! it has a hole in the cylinder wall! the rim?
Back to Top
painter777 View Drop Down
Hard Corps
Hard Corps
Avatar

Joined: Feb 18 2016
Location: Central MI
Status: Offline
Points: 656
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote painter777 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Jul 27 2020 at 11:39pm
The hole underneath is the port hole to clean out.
There is a cut away here some where you'll be able to see how that hole runs at an angle to the gas hole in the barrel.

Looks as though its got chipped from the 'Rim'. Maybe from someone trying to stake and the punch slipped.
Shouldn't be a problem IMO as long as your nut threads in tight........... but not too tight.

Someone will point you towards the cut away so you can see what I can't type clearly.
For now, take a breath, you should be fine.

Other Opinions ??

Cheers,
Ch-P777

PS: If my pictures don't work see this link on Gas Cylinders.......... Thanks to The Sleepless One:
 





Living Free because of those that serve.....
Back to Top
W5USMC View Drop Down
Hard Corps
Hard Corps
Avatar

Joined: Apr 29 2017
Location: Missouri
Status: Offline
Points: 1356
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote W5USMC Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Jul 27 2020 at 11:56pm
Originally posted by painter777 painter777 wrote:

Shouldn't be a problem IMO as long as your nut threads in tight........... but not too tight.

Agree that it should not be an issue as long as the nut tightens up, have seen a few like that.


Wayne
USMC Retired
NRA Life Member
Back to Top
New2brass View Drop Down
Moderator Group
Moderator Group
Avatar
Dan Pinto, Photo Editor

Joined: Nov 29 2015
Location: CT
Status: Offline
Points: 2684
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote New2brass Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Jul 28 2020 at 1:15pm
TM 9-1276 C1 (correction order 1) dated 4, September 1956:
TM 9-1276 17, Feb 1953, is changed as follows: 
56: Disassembly
 b.Removing Gas Piston and Piston Nut (Field or Depot Maintenance).
 Note. (Added) The using of troop organization is authorized to disassemble the gas piston nut from the gas cylinder for cleaning purposes under the supervision of the organizational artificer. 

this predates the PS monthly by 5 years.
Just because a nut has stake marks does not mean it is staked, it may have been removed and not re-staked.

Back to Top
 Post Reply Post Reply

Forum Jump Forum Permissions View Drop Down

Forum Software by Web Wiz Forums® version 12.01
Copyright ©2001-2018 Web Wiz Ltd.

This page was generated in 0.109 seconds.