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M1 Carbine Serial Number Spread Sheets

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jackp1028 View Drop Down
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    Posted: Feb 12 2021 at 10:48am
M1 Carbine Serial Number Spread Sheets




Purpose of the S/N Spread Sheets:

   1.     Establish probable “Made By” dates. (Generally, it is assumed the “Made By” date is within one month of the barrel date unless otherwise in conflict with a documented historical event.)

   2.     Provide to collectors a link to the documented information such as Carbine of the Month Data Sheets, CCNL Articles, auction listings, written descriptions, photographs, etc. for listed serial numbers that may have historic significance or have been manufactured in the same timeframe as the collector’s carbine.

   3.     Identify timeframes and S/N ranges for specific carbine features. (Example: When did Winchester use Underwood receivers?)

   4.     If a carbine is offered for sale with a serial number that is close to one that is documented, the configuration can be compared to the descriptions in the provided links, helping to confirm the carbines originality.

     
The serial numbers contained herein come from the following sources:

   1.     Larry Ruth’s “War Baby!” and “War Baby 3” documents specific events and the dates they occurred related to specific carbine serial numbers.

   2.     The Carbines of the Month (COM) featured in the 384 editions of the Carbine Club News Letters (CCNL’s) document specific information recognized as reliable about specific carbines.

   3.     Specific articles in the Carbine Club News Letters (CCNL’s) that include serial numbers, barrel dates and information of interest such as significant historical or technical information.

   4.     The Civilian Marksmanship Program. CMP Completed Auction listings web site provides written descriptions and photographs of auctioned carbines that are believed to have come directly from the U. S. government and are free of reproduction parts.

             Here’s the link: Past CMP Auctions

   5.     The carbines showcased in the Carbine Collectors Club's "Featured Carbines" and "Carbines of the Collectors" forums. Note" Clicking on the link in the PDF will take you directly to the original post.

   6.     The serial numbers in these spread sheets do not necessarily include all submitted Data Sheets from Club members. We continue to encourage the submission of Data Sheets to grow the source of data for future possible updates.


The Probable “Made By” Dates are estimated based on the following evidence:

   1.     Patterns that are indicated by consistent series of recorded barrel dates. Barrel dates that obviously conflict with reasonable manufacturing dates are noted “Inconsistent Barrel Date”.

   2.     Documented historical events from the War Baby! series of books showing specific dates.

   3.     In the case of Winchester, records showing the last receiver S/N stamped each day of production. This is not necessarily the date the carbine is completed.

   4.     Estimated "Made By" dates are generally supported by published monthly production quantities while taking the effect of scrap and unused serial numbers into consideration.


Below are links to the PDF searchable spread sheets for each prime contractor (After launching a file, you can key "Ctrl F" to use the search function):

           International Business Machines Corp. (I.B.M.)

           Inland Division of General Motors

           Irwin-Pedersen Arms Co./Saginaw Steering, Gear Grand Rapids (IP/S’G’)

           National Postal Meter (NPM)

           Quality Hardware and Machine Co. (QHMC)

           Rock-Ola Corporation

           Saginaw Steering Gear of General Motors (S.G.)

           Standard Products Company

           Underwood Elliot Fisher Co.

           Winchester Repeating Arms Co.

Edited by jackp1028 - Feb 12 2021 at 1:42pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote W5USMC Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Feb 12 2021 at 12:38pm
What a great resource JackP, thanks for putting this together.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 1989LX Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Feb 12 2021 at 1:08pm
This is fantastic! Thanks awfully for creating this!

If someone has a serial number they want to add, are you taking serials to update the lists with? Because if so, I have an S'G' to contribute.
USGI magazines are like potato chips, you can't have just one!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote jackp1028 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Feb 12 2021 at 1:28pm
@1989XL, I welcome contributions but would prefer that they originate from a source that can later be independently referenced such as CCNL's, CMP Auction listings, Carbine Club "Featured Carbines" or "Carbines of the Collectors" or such sources as War Baby!. The key is that they should be documented in a way that readers can independently access the original source.

Perhaps you can submit your S'G' in the "Carbines of the Collectors" forum along with photos and a Data Sheet and then it could be added to a future update of the spread sheet.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote GotSnlB28 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Feb 12 2021 at 10:08pm
@jackp thanks for putting this together! Nicely done.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote jackp1028 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Feb 12 2021 at 10:13pm
@GotSnlB28, I didn't do it alone. I got help from New2brass, Hunterman, W5USMC and tenOCEE. Others have offered future help. Hopefully this will continue to grow.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote GotSnlB28 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Feb 12 2021 at 10:44pm
Originally posted by jackp1028 jackp1028 wrote:

@GotSnlB28, I didn't do it alone. I got help from New2brass, Hunterman, W5USMC and tenOCEE. Others have offered future help. Hopefully this will continue to grow.


Nice group effort guys. If I can be of any assistance let me know.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote ncin1911 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Feb 13 2021 at 7:54am
Very nice job fellows! Clap
I fleshed out a similar spreadsheet for IBM using many of the same resources that compliments my IBM binder of notes and CCNL's.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote NewScotlander Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Feb 13 2021 at 8:42am
For Inland production, the Saginaw receivers (700,000 thru 940,000+) were not produced in sequential order with the Inland receivers. See CCNL 346, page 4, second paragraph. Same with the second serial number block Saginaw receivers.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Charles Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Feb 13 2021 at 9:34am
It was great seeing my S'G' s serial number in that list, it's the first time I've ever seen it in print.

Thanks guys.  
Charles
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote jackp1028 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Feb 13 2021 at 11:02am
@NewScotlander PM sent.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote jackp1028 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Feb 15 2021 at 3:08pm
@Charles, which S'G' was yours? I'll make a note.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Nevinator Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Feb 15 2021 at 5:36pm
this is awesome!  Thank you for your hard work.
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Charles View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Charles Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Feb 15 2021 at 5:54pm
Mine is # 3549164 It is the one with the hand carved stock from the Philippines my dad brought back.  "THE GIFT"
Charles
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 03collector Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Feb 15 2021 at 5:55pm
Wow can't believe it great job on the spread sheet. I saw both  my carbines my Inland sn. 938 and my Winchester sn. 1102913. Just posted  pictures a few weeks ago keep up the good work.
With covid shutting down so many shows this is all thats left to do.
I have learned a lot in just a short time here.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote jangle Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Feb 15 2021 at 9:38pm
I concur.  My hat is off to you guys for all your hard work!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote SSNPingjockey Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Feb 16 2021 at 2:27pm
Jack,

Think you noted a new high WTA number.

After looking at the Underwood section of your serial number compilation, there may be a new high number for the WTA serials.

On the Club's page with the highest and lowest serial numbers known, is that s/n 2,404,928 is the highest Underwood serial for a WTA Winchester.

Your new list now has 2,405,154 that was sold at CMP Auction #1790.

Great job, by the way!  Your work on the data and posting it is really appreciated.


Edited by SSNPingjockey - Feb 18 2021 at 9:31am
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote SSNPingjockey Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Feb 22 2021 at 11:22am
UEF 1350262 is still alive!

As a follow-up to Jack's post with the serial number spreadsheet, the Underwood section noted that UEF s/n 1350262 was a rifle used for testing.

- First five of 500 carbines production tested Dec. 11, 1942 (WB pg 111)
- Also used to test brazed trigger housing Mar. 13, 1943(WB pg 366).

As a point of documentation of the rifles used for testing, this one is still alive and kicking and, as some may have seen, was sold on GB in either March or April of 2020.  This is the only photo that I can locate that I saved from the auction.

I also recall that the only original aspect of the rifle was the receiver and rear flip sight.  The remainder, including the barrel I think, was all mix-master and neither early, nor UEF.

I spoke to Dan and he reminded me that since Inland actually made the first receivers used by UEF through 1350209, that this receiver would actually be the 53rd receiver made by Underwood. (CCNL #259)





Edited by SSNPingjockey - Feb 22 2021 at 12:53pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote jackp1028 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Feb 22 2021 at 11:40am
Great find!! I hope there are many more like this.
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