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IBM .30M1 sn 3675209

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patrickduis View Drop Down
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    Posted: Jan 12 2016 at 10:19am
Here are some pics of my carbine. I use it for match-shooting indoors at 25m (because or range is not longer) and outside at 100m. I also want to learn a lot of its specific features and am -trying- to fill in the datasheet I got from Jim (thanks Jim!!!). That will be added later when I have more info.
I hope to learn a lot about these carbines with the help on this forum.
The carbine looks very refurbished and shows a lot of wear. I think the barrel, sights and stock were renewed.

Here are the most important markings and explanations I got from Jim:

Barrel band: SI 
American Radiator Standard Sanitary Corporation as a subcontractor for Inland

Left receiver: 3675209, under that 3 IBM
Under sights: IBM CORP, under that 3675209 (barely visible)

Integral gas cylinder
Short barrel skirt
Marking under barrel: square with line across.

Flat Bolt: SG

Type III slide
Gas block underside: OAB Auto-Ordnance subcontractor for IBM

Stamped Rear sights I.R. CO International Register Company (replacement)

Walnut stock, low wood. Modified oval cut, pot belly

Type IV trigger housing. Trigger marked MI
Type IV rotary safety
Type III mag catches manufactured by Walt Manufacturing Company and Commercial Controls (formerly National Postal Meter).

Pouch: Airtress Midland

Magazines: MN:National Postal Meter IS:International Silver



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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote New2brass Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Jan 12 2016 at 11:23am
http://www.uscarbinecal30.com/forum/topic26.html
for data sheets and a link walking you through the data sheet.
 
What make is the barrel, Usually marked just near the front sight
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote patrickduis Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Jan 12 2016 at 12:16pm
There is no marking on the barrel near the front sight, therefore I think the barrel has been replaced.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote imntxs564 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Jan 12 2016 at 12:45pm
Originally posted by patrickduis patrickduis wrote:

I use it for match-shooting indoors


What type of Ammo you use for Match Grade Shooting ?

The MN Magazine was manufacture by Mattatuck Mfg. Co. What I don't know if later International Silver started at sometime making them all for the M1 Carbine Manufacturers like they did for the Oilers.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote patrickduis Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Jan 12 2016 at 1:16pm
Thanks for the info. The MN magazine is slightly larger than the other one (IS). But the MN almost always gives a misfeed at the last 2 cartridges. The MN magazine is a tight fit in the carbine whereas the IS is looser. But the IS magazine always feeds correctly, no misfeed so far.

For the matches I use most of the time just standard ammo, either S&B 110grs FMJ or the PRVI partizan (cheapest) 110grs FMJ RN. I notice no difference in performance.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote imntxs564 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Jan 12 2016 at 1:30pm
Mostly I use that for target. If it works for you than great. Look at some other Ammo and read about them. Some will give you better results in Match Grade Competition.

I never heard of a size difference in Mags. I have many, many Mags with All sort of Makers Mark on them and all seem to be the correct size. Check your Mag spring. The high side of the spring should go towards the back of the Mag follower. It shows it in the Dept. of Army Technical Manuals and some books written about the M1 Carbine. That might be one of the problems. Also the Retaining Lugs can be worn on thhe Mag. Also the Mag Catch too could be worn.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote patrickduis Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Jan 12 2016 at 3:42pm
Thanks for the info, I'll check that.

What brand and kind of ammo gives you good results? I need to try a few boxes out......Next time at the gunsmith's I'll check what he has and buy a box or 2 of each to test it. 
I will also bring my carbine+magazines to him because he's also a big fan of carbines and wants to check it and give it a little tune-up job.

The sights are pretty much on now, this is 5 shots with the PRVI ammo (don't look at the black dots, this is my test-card that I always use before actually starting to shoot for counts, I use the same card every week until it falls apart....they cost euro 0,20 each here....)
Maybe 1 or 2 clicks more to the left....and then the sights are really on.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote imntxs564 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Jan 12 2016 at 8:06pm
In Match Grade I like to use either Federal Power-Shock Ammunition 30 Carbine 110 Grain. The ammo runs about 3 MOA for accuracy which is acceptable given maximum ranges. I have taken this load to 200 yards with great accuracy.

I Also use American Eagle which is also a Federal Brand Ammo. Both 110 gr. When I shot S & B it took forever to clean. The residue just goes everywhere and I myself after 3 times of using S&B I take my Bolt apart and give it a good bath.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote patrickduis Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Jul 26 2016 at 7:11pm

I'm shooting my carbine now for a few months..........standing 1st rank still in our local club match ranking, because there are not too much shooters that shoot this expensive ammo, about 20 guys, (but the ex-gunnery sergeant that was ill for a few months, my trainer, is slowly catching up with me........) .This is a kneeled score on a 25m target.......
I'm feeling I'm reaching the end of improvement now..........followed a few US army rifle marksmanship video's and stuff.............Is there a way to improve my carbine (or me) to get ahead of Gsgt cathing up with me?
I'm an experienced handgun shooter but not an experienced rifleman.....any tips are welcome.....
I'm currently shooting PRVI parizan .30m1 ammo by the way......a bit dirty but the cheapest in Holland at the moment. Tomorrow I'll have to get me some new ammo, first I'm going to see what the shop has......in Holland PRVI and S&B are almost the only ammo brands to get for .30M1....
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote imntxs564 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Jul 26 2016 at 7:43pm
Nice Shooting...Is that a Type 2 Barrel Band or a Cut Type 3 Bayonet Lug ? I don't see many potbelly stocks with Original Type 2 Barrel Bands. I've heard from a Match Shooter that if the Barrel Band is over Tighten it could make a difference in your shooting results. The grouping looks nice. If it's always shoots like this check your Front Sight and Rear Sight alignment. It shouldn't be off by much. It looks like if there is anything wrong it's not much your target looks nice. If you haven't done nothing to your sights from outdoor shooting to indoor shooting just play with it little. But it does look good.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote patrickduis Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Jul 27 2016 at 2:58am
Thanks, I think my carbine (bought it as a shooter, not a real collector piece) has been modified a lot before I bought it for 200 euro's, see the pictures above. It belonged to an older shooter that had to stop because of health reasons.  In Holland it is obgligatory to shoot at least 18 times per year, the police checks that in your logbook (every time you shoot the logbook is signed by a board-member of the club).

I think the stock has been replaced by this potbelly and the barrel also because I don't see a serial number near the front sight, I also see the barrel has been in a vise sometime, probably for the replacement. The front sight has been "sporterized" and is adjusted quite well. I put the rear sight on 100 yds (first "click"). At 25m I aim at the bottom of the black circle of the paper target (I adjusted the sights for all my handguns also the same, because I'm a primary target shooter).
The receiver/trigger part looks original still.

The only real issue I had with the gun, is that when the barrel band is not super tight, it comes loose very quickly. Therefore I modified the barrel band spring a bit, because it was not "cathing" the barrel band correctly. 
The top piece of the stock does not have a perfect match with the lower potbelly part....but it works.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote aschaefer Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Jul 27 2016 at 3:33pm
Hope I am allowed to jump in.

Most of the shooters here in Luxembourg are using Remington Ammo for the matches unless the reload themselves. Some are using the Partizan, like myself. Problem for the moment is that there is no Partizan ammo available in the whole country (mind you Luxembourg is really small so it is easy to check :-))
According to my favourite gun shop when the Partizan ammo will be available again it will be 25% more expensive than the previous lot they have sold, which will make the price almost even to the Remington ammo and therefore I will probably reconsider my ammo choice.

By the way, great shooting. Need to try myself at 25m just to see how I'll do. All our matches are at 50m.

With regard to your barrel, are there any other markings apart from the one on the picture?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote patrickduis Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Jul 27 2016 at 5:22pm
Hi to my Luxemburg neighbor, you live quite nearby compared to many other guys around here, of course you can jump in, its always nice to have a worldwide chat on carbines.
I see many carbines for sale online in the US, note that I bought my IBM (non original, very much tampered with, shooter, not collector) for only 200 euro's. But that is the normal price here in Holland for a carbine in this shape. They are actually not so popular b ecause of the expensive ammo and not many clubs have a match for it. Since I'm member of an ex- Dutch Marines Shooting club, it is very popular however in my shooting club. Many of the old guys here actually served and fought with this gun in the East Indies and Korea after WWII. The match type is therefore called "veteran service rifle" for that reason.
There are actually no markings at all on the barrel, therefore I think it is a Dutch gunsmith retrofit.
PRVI is not difficult to buy here, it is the standard brand carbine ammo, and the cheapest. This evening after work I bought 3 boxes of PRVI for 19 euro's each. Not cheap, but anyway, I love my carbine, right? It's about the same price as the Magtech .45ACP I also bought.
When I told the guys if they have cleaner burning carbine ammo than PRVI and S&B those two guys looked at me like: "What the he,l is he talking about, it's a very old rifle, so it needs a lot of cleaning and carressing: what the heck. And tjey are RIGHT!" Treat this old warhorse with respect and clean it as much as possible. It worked hard in WWII, Korea and Vietnam, so it deserves to go like some kind of gun-sauna, right?
Need to start with reloading though, ammo brass gets more and more expensive each year........about 15 years ago a box of CCI .22LR was 2,50 euro, now it is already 4,50 euro's (and rising).....
What scores do you get with your carbine at 50 meters compared to my standard 25meters official KNSA paper target? Where do you aim and how did you adjust your sight? You're shooting prone at 50mtrs right, whereas I can only shoot standing and kneeling at our inhouse range. With the standing position I have most problems......much worse than this, that is where the gunnery Sgt. is quickly cathing up with me, need to improve on the standing position, but how?
- I am already following an US army training video with right elbow way up
- I'm using the hasty sling, well adjusted
- I breathe correctly
- Feet standing apart correctly
- Natural firing position (check with eyes closed and then opening) perfect on target
- Good trigger pull

All, tips are welcome here. Please help because I really want to win the club match this year! I'll have to improve myself, not the rifle, to win.....Maybe shoot even more than 2x per week?

I also asked the son of the shop owner for advice, This guy kniws his stuff, he's an upper grade "amurier" from the Liege armorer school (where FN Herstal is situated). He told me that for example that recrowning is a very tricky job that must only be done when absolutely necessary. And believe me, this guy knows his stuff. If you see those hi-tech ultra heavy rifles he's building for the Dutch southern shooting guilds that shoot enormous large heavy lead balls with it (they call it "bullkes")......wow man, you then know what I mean.....

So....improvement has to come from myself, not the rifle (come on, its only 25 yds......)
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote aschaefer Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Jul 28 2016 at 3:40pm
Hi from Luxembourg!
I am afraid I am not the right person to ask when it comes to shooting technique. I am sure you do already a lot better than me.
My best result, on the same targets as you use, on 50m is a 94 out of 100. My average is 90 but last weekend I did not even reach this. It was the first time I was shooting from a shooting table and somehow I was not able to find a good shooting position. Best result in last weekend's match was 297 out of 300 (10 shots within 5 min, 10 shots within 4 min and the last series of 10 within 3 min). That's the guy you should talk to :-) But I don't know him.

19 Euro for 50 rounds of Partizan is not too bad. I have bought 750 rounds at a price of 18Eur per 50 rounds last year and was very happy. Now the S&B is around 22 Euro and the Remington just under 25 Euro.

And about the misfeeds I have to agree with the other forum member. Mostly it comes from the mag. Check the spring, it is quite surprising how often you will find the spring installed the wrong way within the mag body.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Wrdsmth Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Jul 28 2016 at 7:19pm
Hopefully you've seen this: http://thecmp.org/wp-content/uploads/CarbineNotes.pdf

After accomplishing all that advice, and trying some different ammunition, you've done about all you can without upgrading to a better barrel (like a Criterion unit from Fulton Armory).
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote patrickduis Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Jul 29 2016 at 2:55am
Thanks for all this info, especially the tuning guide. I definately agree that misfeeds are often caused by the magazine. I have 1 old type magazine and a newer replica: only the old one cycles well and the newer one often gives a misfeed. I'll check the spring.

@aschaefere: you shoot benchrest rand prone right? The result I put above here was shot by me in the kneeling position.

Criterion barrel from Fulton Armory: very interesting.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote aschaefer Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Jul 29 2016 at 11:00am
No benchrest, only prone.
In our matches nothing but shooting gloves is allowed.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote patrickduis Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Jul 29 2016 at 2:46pm
In our veteran service rifle no gloves nor suits are allowed, you can only use the original sling for support in standing and kneeling position.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote New2brass Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Jul 29 2016 at 9:27pm
Typically guys complain of the carbine shooting high at 25 yards. I believe the consensus is that the bullet is still rising and not fully stabilized.
Have you had this issue?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote patrickduis Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Jul 30 2016 at 3:04am
I don't believe having this issue, but remeber that I set the sights at its minimum, which is 100yds and aim for the bottom of the black circle of the target, to have a more accurate sight picture. But I saw what you say in the bullet drop trajectories.
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