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High-speed video of Carbines firing...

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markserbu View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (3) Thanks(3)   Quote markserbu Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Topic: High-speed video of Carbines firing...
    Posted: Jul 21 2022 at 11:57am
Just made this quickie video last night to check out the actions on my Rock-Ola and IBM.  I figure it would be appreciated here, and most likely some folks here know what I didn't know about the Korean writing on the stock of the IBM.  https://youtu.be/clfW4cZg1O0
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Jond41403 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Jul 21 2022 at 12:37pm
Welcome to The forum mark! Thanks for the cool video! I'm used to seeing you on YouTube with your awesome 50's haha
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote Smokpole Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Jul 21 2022 at 7:47pm
Interesting seeing the extractor movement too.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote john843 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Jul 21 2022 at 9:51pm
Very interesting and very cool. Besides being fun to watch, that looks like it could have really good diagnostic potential for cycling problems and such. Thanks for sharing!

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote markserbu Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Jul 21 2022 at 10:37pm
Haha, thanks.  With YouTube it's getting tough to do ANY gun content, at least to get paid while doing it!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote markserbu Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Jul 21 2022 at 10:40pm
Originally posted by john843 john843 wrote:

Very interesting and very cool. Besides being fun to watch, that looks like it could have really good diagnostic potential for cycling problems and such. Thanks for sharing!

John

Ok, now I figured out how to quote.  ;-)  Yeah, I've got some high-speed footage of an M2 carbine that I can't seem to find.  It runs for several rounds but you can see the bolt not going back as far with each round until it won't pick up a new one from the mag.  You definitely can't beat high-speed video for diagnosing cycling problems! 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Timothy Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Jul 22 2022 at 1:35pm
Nice to see the dynamics of all the parts. What sort of lighting did you use for the higher framing rates?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote markserbu Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Jul 22 2022 at 6:45pm
Originally posted by Timothy Timothy wrote:

Nice to see the dynamics of all the parts. What sort of lighting did you use for the higher framing rates?

I have a couple of really badass LED lights that are specifically made for high-speed video work.  I hope to get some more Carbine high-speed footage this weekend and I'll take a picture of the setup if I do.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote blackfish Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Jul 22 2022 at 7:01pm
Time Reference:

To step thru the video frame by frame is interesting. It would be really nice if you could label the frames by time or number from start giving the frame rate.

Most "high speed" videos on YouTube are "abridged" (to keep the video filesize manageable), providing only, say, every 20th frame but nowhere is it stated what's missing, so to extract event timing from the video is impossible.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote David Milisock Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Jul 23 2022 at 9:14am
The slide bounce once entering battery is very interesting. Depending on when the next round is fired that definitely would affect extraction timing.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote New2brass Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Jul 24 2022 at 12:23pm
Mark. Welcome to the forums, I know the name and I have seen your videos before. Good Stuff!

On Carbine Williams, He was a character and the movie, well lets say it has embellishments.

Check out or pages on Williams


On the high speed, what type of camera are you using?
I am guessing that lighting is always an issue. Would daylight be beneficial to brighten things up?

I was privy to some some pictures of the carbines from the Olin/Winchester collection. Winchester had experimented with different gas systems as well as their own design of a full auto carbine. One of the stocks had lines on the side of the stock marking the slide travel. As best as we could figure this was used in high speed film to measure just how far the slide traveled. I would love to see that footage if it exists!
 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote markserbu Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Jul 24 2022 at 3:43pm
Originally posted by blackfish blackfish wrote:

Time Reference:

To step thru the video frame by frame is interesting. It would be really nice if you could label the frames by time or number from start giving the frame rate.

Most "high speed" videos on YouTube are "abridged" (to keep the video filesize manageable), providing only, say, every 20th frame but nowhere is it stated what's missing, so to extract event timing from the video is impossible.

I mostly use the high-speed video for firearm development and it's an incredibly valuable tool.  Putting videos on YouTube is more for fun and I just don't have the editing time to do a frame count.  Actually, there's probably a utility somewhere that would show a frame count right in the video.  Yet another thing to hand off to my video editor, when/if I get another one...
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote markserbu Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Jul 24 2022 at 3:58pm
Originally posted by New2brass New2brass wrote:

Mark. Welcome to the forums, I know the name and I have seen your videos before. Good Stuff!

On Carbine Williams, He was a character and the movie, well lets say it has embellishments.

Check out or pages on Williams


On the high speed, what type of camera are you using?
I am guessing that lighting is always an issue. Would daylight be beneficial to brighten things up?

I was privy to some some pictures of the carbines from the Olin/Winchester collection. Winchester had experimented with different gas systems as well as their own design of a full auto carbine. One of the stocks had lines on the side of the stock marking the slide travel. As best as we could figure this was used in high speed film to measure just how far the slide traveled. I would love to see that footage if it exists!
 

Thanks!  Will have to read up on Carbine.  Was definitely a good story but Hollywood tries to always make sure it's a good one, truth be damned. 

Chronos 1.4 camera.  Yeah, sunlight is best but it's nice to have a controlled environment (that's also air conditioned!)

Makes sense to witness mark the stock.  I usually put pieces of tape or paint marker lines on my guns when I'm doing high-speed video analysis. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (2) Thanks(2)   Quote markserbu Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Jul 24 2022 at 3:59pm
New video, this time with a magazine!  BTW, where can I get GOOD 30-round mags?  I don't care if they're original or not, as long as they function well.  Oh, and just a quick check going frame-by-frame of the raw footage shows that the bolt velocity in recoil is 15 feet per second.  For the nerds like me who care about that sort of thing. Wink

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote W5USMC Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Jul 24 2022 at 4:16pm
Love these videos! Is that steel cased ammo?
Numrich sells USGI 30 round mags described as fair condition, the ones I got from them needed cleaned up a bit, slight pitting but work fine.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote blackfish Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Jul 25 2022 at 10:40am
Originally posted by markserbu markserbu wrote:

New video, this time with a magazine!  BTW, where can I get GOOD 30-round mags?  I don't care if they're original or not, as long as they function well.  Oh, and just a quick check going frame-by-frame of the raw footage shows that the bolt velocity in recoil is 15 feet per second.  For the nerds like me who care about that sort of thing. Wink




:2T:

Very interesting. Just a point of reference FWIW from a nerd IIRC, from video made at Inland during development, initial recoil slide velocity was on the order of 20-25 ft/sec

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote markserbu Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Jul 29 2022 at 11:11am
Originally posted by W5USMC W5USMC wrote:

Love these videos! Is that steel cased ammo?
Numrich sells USGI 30 round mags described as fair condition, the ones I got from them needed cleaned up a bit, slight pitting but work fine.

Yeah, it's the crappy Russian stuff.  Will get some proper ammo eventually.  Thanks for the mag suggestion!

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote markserbu Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Jul 29 2022 at 11:12am
Originally posted by blackfish blackfish wrote:

Originally posted by markserbu markserbu wrote:

New video, this time with a magazine!  BTW, where can I get GOOD 30-round mags?  I don't care if they're original or not, as long as they function well.  Oh, and just a quick check going frame-by-frame of the raw footage shows that the bolt velocity in recoil is 15 feet per second.  For the nerds like me who care about that sort of thing. Wink




:2T:

Very interesting. Just a point of reference FWIW from a nerd IIRC, from video made at Inland during development, initial recoil slide velocity was on the order of 20-25 ft/sec


Yeah, my velocity was the average over the whole stroke.  I may go back and look to see if my results agree with that 20-25 number, thanks!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote blackfish Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Jul 29 2022 at 4:10pm
You've got one heck of a tool there. Ejection of spent cases is also interesting. Different slides were designed, in part, using video like this, to mitigate a very very difficult problem.

If you don't mind me asking, is your equipment borrowed, rented, or bought?

Thanks
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Jond41403 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Jul 29 2022 at 4:36pm
I would guess most likely owned(I could be completely wrong though). You should really check out his YouTube channels if you haven't already, they are extremely informative on machining, heat treating, welding, you name it. He is an amazing designer of firearms in general. I hope I'm not breaking any rules here by recommending someone's YouTube channels but for people on here that do not know, they really need to check him out. Outstanding content
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