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Receiver/Bolt Life Expectancy

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DonFlynn View Drop Down
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    Posted: Nov 25 2019 at 11:06pm
Ok, my Carbine question for the month. What's a average life expectancy for a USGI receiver and bolt?

Reason I ask is so far I've had a new barrel installed on 1 USGI Inland Carbine that had a Blue Sky import marked barrel, this one here.

http://www.uscarbinecal30.com/forum/range-report-new-m1-carbine-rebuilt-by-fulton_topic4178.html

I sent my CMP bought 1943 Inland to Fulton after I got that one back expecting it would need recrowning the barrel. I found out on the tech inspection that it gauged a "3+", so I went ahead and ok'd a new barrel for it also (chrome lined if the bolt head spaced, "normal" Criterion barrel if not).

The bolt was in "like new" condition from what Fulton said but it was the early style bolt, which makes me wonder if it wasn't a replacement by CMP since the barrel is that worn (I've only fired about 1000 rounds since I got it in 2007).

I've also got a Made in Japan "Howa" Carbine there for a tech check. They said that barrel gauges at a "2" on the 1944 Inland barrel but I'm thinking I might as well replace it when they call me on it end of the year.

I'm thinking if Fulton does the same with the 2 they have now that they did with the one I linked I should have 3 like new rifles unless I have problems with the bolts or receivers wearing out before the new barrels   
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floydthecat View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote floydthecat Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Nov 26 2019 at 4:37am
It depends on how the gun is used and cared-for, but barrel replacement should be considered based on degrading accuracy and not by looks or measurements alone. If one sees groups opening up on a well-fired gun and there are no other good reasons, it might be time to consider it. The load, projectile design and maintenance will affect barrel life.

Bolt wear can be obvious by observing contact points on the lugs, finish and peening at the rear, but may only be a concern if it won’t head space, or of course cracked. ME may be a selling or buying point, but it may not affect accuracy to any unusable degree. Based on what I read, an ME of 2 was acceptable at rebuild. I'd never change a barrel that measured a 2 or 3 just to get a 1.

After rambling here for the sake of conversation, I think I have read that the carbine was designed for a useful life of 15,000-20,000 rounds, but I don't have any documentation of where I read that and it's based on my 72 year-old memory. I have heard a figure of 50,000 and even that it can’t be done. My take on it is that if one continues to print where I want it on paper, head spaces and functions...I don’t let ME bother me. I have an Inland that swallows a gauge, yet shoots as good as any other. I have an idea that many barrels are replaced that never needed to be.


Edited by floydthecat - Nov 26 2019 at 7:20am
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Donnie View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Donnie Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Nov 26 2019 at 6:48am
Don, you ask a question that many a novice, like me,  wonder about.
Floyd, thank you for an informative response that makes sense to me. I am curious at to what others have to say on this fundamental carbine ownership question.
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DonFlynn View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote DonFlynn Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Nov 26 2019 at 10:32am
I'm basing the barrel replacement on what the armorer told me about the barrel on the current Inland at FA. The one in link that I had rebarrelled already shots like the new production FA I bought last year.

The one getting the new barrel now I'd hoped to keep original but was getting lose groups at 100 yards. I was hoping the recrown would do the trick but that wasn't to be. I'd rather have a rifle I can trust 100% than a safe queen (which the current Inland will probably be a light use rifle).

My concern is the 2 Carbines I plan on shooting on a regular basis, the ex Blue Sky marked one and the "Howa". I figure since those didn't have the collectability factor those Carbines will see the range on a regular basis, 1000 rounds a year when weather permits (per gun maybe....we'll see).

I figure the chrome lined barrels are "suppose" to be longer life barrels than the normal USGI barrels, I just wanted a rough idea if I could expect a bolt failure.

I'll keep a eye on the "working guns". I'm wanting at least 1 Carbine as a "heirloom" gun (I'm 61) for my relatives when I'm gone...    
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floydthecat View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote floydthecat Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Nov 26 2019 at 10:52am
I have experienced one bolt failure. A cracked right lug on a N 14 flat bolt. Cracking of this particular bolt is mentioned quite often.
I think the only “preventative” thing one can do is keep head space in check and visually check the bolt for excessive peening/mushrooming on the rear where the surface rides-down the hammer. If a bolt is severely peened on the rear, it’s a sure sign that it’s seen a lot of shooting. Head spacing will insure the lug wear is not excessive. The bolts I have had that failed head spacing were usually well worn....and it was obvious.

The powers-that-be settled on a third bolt (round), so that is what I prefer in any shooter. Flat bolts may be correct for the SN, but the Type 3 was developed for a reason. 

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floydthecat View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote floydthecat Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Nov 26 2019 at 3:38pm
BTW....I have a Rock-Ola shooter that’s a weak 3 and if it starts faltering, I plan to ship it to Fulton for a barrel. It has an Underwood on it now, but there is no way I plan to pay the price for a new Rock barrel. I have read more than one story about a local gunsmith (or want-to-be) screwing up a carbine barrel swap. Fulton seems to be the place to deal with.
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DonFlynn View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote DonFlynn Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Nov 26 2019 at 4:00pm
Originally posted by floydthecat floydthecat wrote:

BTW....I have a Rock-Ola shooter that’s a weak 3 and if it starts faltering, I plan to ship it to Fulton for a barrel. It has an Underwood on it now, but there is no way I plan to pay the price for a new Rock barrel. I have read more than one story about a local gunsmith (or want-to-be) screwing up a carbine barrel swap. Fulton seems to be the place to deal with.


If you can find a new or decent USGI barrel Fulton would still be the way to go for a barrel swap IMO. It would cost more but long term the Rock would still be considered a "pure" USGI as opposed to my "hybrids".

I've resigned myself to having Fulton service my Carbines anymore. The only local smith my area who works on them says he has a 8 month backlog. Fulton takes 13-15 weeks from my experience. Most gunsmiths anymore don't seem to have the proper tools or knowledge to work on M-1 Carbines anymore.

I'll post pics of the latest rebuild when I get it next week. Hopefully I'll be able to get it to the range before the end of the year and run some ammo through it. A decent zero will have to wait till spring, my normal outdoor range is closed still and I'm not expecting it till open till spring now
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Smokpole Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Nov 27 2019 at 1:14pm
I did a comparison study some years ago on the deterioration of accuracy of carbine barrels with varying degrees of muzzle wear. The results were rather surprising. Muzzle wear went from less than 1 to 5. 24 carbines were tested. Range was 100 yards off sand bags. Carbines with a muzzle wear of 5 shot groups on average only 1 inch larger than those with MEs less then 2! Unless there is extreme muzzle wear or muzzle damage of some type, The ME wear really doesn't make a whole lot of difference! However, crown damage and cleaning rod damage does make a difference. That is why the military counter-bored many of the muzzles. It restored accuracy to the barrels. Always keep this in mind. If a muzzle "swallows" a .30 bullet, check to see if the muzzle has been counter-bored. Test fire the carbine for accuracy before condemning the barrel to the scrap heap. Some of them may still be quite accurate.
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floydthecat View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote floydthecat Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Nov 27 2019 at 2:00pm
I am constantly looking for that old Rock-Ola barrel measuring a 2-3 that somebody changed out.😁 
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