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Hessen Police Carbine Manual

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BER911 View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote BER911 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Topic: Hessen Police Carbine Manual
    Posted: Nov 21 2019 at 8:18am
I recently acquired a couple accessories for my small collection of Occupation Carbines from a gentleman in Lodz, Poland.

One of the items is the official Hessen Police Regulations and User Manual (M1 Carbine) issued by the Federal State of Hesse in September 1954.  A similar manual is featured in the "Germany's Story" section of the history of Occupation Carbines on our main site.

This particular manual was issued by the Hessen Department of Interior on Thursday, September 10, 1954 and signed by Managing Director Doctor Schubert.  It contains a lot of interesting information about the care and use of the carbine... all in German.  Also has some very nice diagrams detailing all the parts and how to disassemble/assemble the carbine.








Semper Fi, Bruce
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote W5USMC Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Nov 21 2019 at 8:32am
Nice addition to your collection, Bruce.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote tenOCEE Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Nov 21 2019 at 8:48am
I'm looking for some narrow Riemenbugles if anyone has a line on one or two.
I'm not surprised there aren't many cognates between German and 'merican' languages. We truncate syllables wherein they expand them. Interesting since half our population was German in the 18s.
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https://grandrapids.wufoo.com/forms/zzlnt0519k86xs/
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote BER911 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Nov 21 2019 at 10:20am
tenOCEE,

I ordered a couple Stolla leather slings recently.  One has arrived and I believe it came from a seller in Liechtenstein.  It is a bit wider and thicker than the Stolla sling that was on my NPM Bavarian I purchased earlier this year.  I mounted it on the Standard Products Bavarian I bought from Jim last month; it looks good on that carbine.

The other Stolla has not yet arrived; it's coming from the guy in Poland where I got the manual shown above.  In the pictures, it looks narrower and thinner.  The thickness of the leather on Stolla's is probably a function of wear.  The ones that have seen a lot of use are worn down a bit (i.e. thinner).

I have lived in Germany twice...once as a youngster from 1953-57 and then again during my working career from 1984-86.  I can read German fairly well, but I have lost my ability to carry on an extended conversation.  I need to brush up though, because the bride and I are visiting the "Fatherland" next May.

Once I receive the Stolla from Poland, I will assess my sling situation and may have a leather sling for sale.  I'll keep you posted.
Semper Fi, Bruce
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote tenOCEE Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Nov 21 2019 at 10:46am
Wonder if they utilized the approach of thinning leather to fit through the slot and back (skiving?)? We've seen the squashed oilers that I presume were used with the leather sling.
Wish I could envision what the area was like at that time. That would be an interesting perspective.
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https://grandrapids.wufoo.com/forms/zzlnt0519k86xs/
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote BER911 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Nov 21 2019 at 11:30am
Originally posted by tenOCEE tenOCEE wrote:

Wonder if they utilized the approach of thinning leather to fit through the slot and back (skiving?)? We've seen the squashed oilers that I presume were used with the leather sling.
Wish I could envision what the area was like at that time. That would be an interesting perspective.

Interesting observation.

The Stolla sling on my NPM Bavarian has either been worn down or "thinned" because it will work with a USGI oiler.  When I bought it, it came with a wooden dowel pin that was used to mount the sling in the stock's sling cut-out.  See photos of this sling here (scroll to bottom of page):


The Stolla that I just bought is too thick to use with an oiler.  It has definitely not been thinned.  Be interesting to see if the leather sling enroute to me from Poland has been "thinned"; the photos look like it has been.

Is it possible the thickness of the leather sling was related to its date of manufacturer?  I do not know the answer, but it is always a possibility.  Possible evidence is the leather sling that came on my NPM appears to be a lower grade of leather, and narrower and thinner.  Possibly made in the 50's when good quality leather was rare in post-war Austria.  
Semper Fi, Bruce
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote New2brass Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Nov 21 2019 at 2:14pm
On the Austrian page under accessories you will see some plastic dowels that were used. The were smaller in diameter to the oiler.



On same page there is some comparisons of belt thicknesses.

I have no idea of what was done over seas nor in the USA back in the day, However, in at least the 70s leather here was sorted by average weight (or thickness) of the hide. There would be variations on the thickness but they would be grouped together. That hide would vary from back to stomach. So one hide could produce several thicknesses if measured with a precision instrument, not something dine with leather.
Leather also stretches and can shrink. It can also be manipulated thinner. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 1989LX Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Nov 21 2019 at 3:17pm
I have a Stolla sling in my collection that will fit with a USGI oiler. I can't say I have seen any thicker ones however.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote BER911 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Nov 22 2019 at 7:47am
Here is the Stolla sling I recently purchased from a seller in Europe.  It has some age to it because of the leather cracks; could also indicate it was not stored and preserved properly.  You can also see the thickness of the leather.  It is mounted on a Standard Products "Bavarian" carbine using a wooden dowel (USGI oiler doesn't fit).

Based on the info on the link New2Brass posted above, this sling appears to have been manufactured in the 1963-70 time frame.






Semper Fi, Bruce
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Donnie Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Nov 22 2019 at 8:38am
Wow, that Stolla sling is stout! 

OP, thanks for sharing the police manual. Most interesting addition to any  carbine collection.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Horrible_Aim Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 12 2020 at 9:34pm
I have a degree in German and lived there for many years, fully fluent. Please let me know if you'd like any translations. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Liberium Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 17 2020 at 2:24am
thats a very nice find that book
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote m1a1fan Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 17 2020 at 9:32pm
Congrats on the pickup Bruce. That's a nice one!

Looking forward to the next show (whenever that is) for the chance to see it in person.


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote sleeplessnashadow Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 17 2020 at 10:53pm
Bruce

I just did an update on the slings shown on the Austrian accessories page.

http://www.bavarianm1carbines.com/austriaaccess.html

The sling you obtained from Europe, does it have the Stolla name or logo on it?

Stolla made leather slings for the Austrians from the 1920's until 1970. Including their military weapons during WWII. Some of their leather SMG slings are about the same length but thicker than the carbine slings.

The carbine slings I've seen have varied in thickness but I haven't seen one that thick. Just means I haven't seen one, not that they didn't make some.

That Hessen book is a real rarity. Nice find.

Jim
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