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Pistol Caliber Carbines

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Carbine Williams View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Carbine Williams Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Topic: Pistol Caliber Carbines
    Posted: Jul 19 2018 at 8:52pm
Not sure if this qualifies but, does my Marlin Camp 9 qualify? Thanks.
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sleeplessnashadow View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote sleeplessnashadow Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Jul 19 2018 at 9:12pm
Hi

The Marlin Camp 9 is a carbine but the carbines here are based on the design of the .30 caliber carbine, Models M1, M1A1, M2 and M3 built for Army Ordnance during WWII. An offshoot of these are the commercially manufactured replicas of the design. Some of which are in handgun calibers.

There are many different rifles from many different countries built as "carbines". Basically a shortened version of various military rifles originally made for use by cavalry. Today the term is used for many rifles with a barrel length 20" and under but not all with that barrel length.

The carbines on this discussion forum and on our web pages were designed small and lighweight as an alternative to the Model 1911 handgun for troops whose duties made the M1 Garand too big of a burden.

Jim
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote floydthecat Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Jul 20 2018 at 8:47am
I think both the Marlin and the Ruger carbines are good guns. Both have been out of production, but Ruger has brought theirs back as a Police carbine. My BIL has an early wood stocked Ruger and the thing weighs as much as a boat-anchor....almost.

I have one of the few 9MM GI style carbines manufactured by Iver Johnson, which remained mostly true to the USGI spec. carbine. I have "hardened" it with a GI bolt and trigger-housing as well as the innards. 9 x 19 is cheap to shoot and the gun weighs-in at about 5-pounds.

I think a 9MM carbine should be in just about everybody's collection. The gun is perfect for HD, is very economical to shoot and ammo can be found under every bush.
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Carbine Williams View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Carbine Williams Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Jul 20 2018 at 11:22am
Thank you. I appreciate you taking the time to explain.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote New2brass Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Jul 20 2018 at 12:11pm
If you stick around I an confident you will fall in love with the US CARBINE CAL. .30 M1, its variants or commercial copies.
 
 
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Carbine Williams View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Carbine Williams Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Jul 20 2018 at 6:49pm
I'm hoping to get an M1 Carbine from the Korean War. My Uncle fought in that war. Master Sergeant. He's still alive. 
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Donnie View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Donnie Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Jul 21 2018 at 5:36pm
I am a 9mm fan and have several Luger P.08s, Browning Hi Powers, not to mention WWII 9mm Kurtz and Cortos pistols. So the thought of a 9mm carbine is on my list. I held and examined a Ruger PC 9mm carbine recently and was impressed. Most posts from owners on forums are very favorable; a few not so much. For a price of about $550 I might just satisfy my temptation some day.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote sleeplessnashadow Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Jul 21 2018 at 7:02pm
FYI, I recommend against buying the Chiappa 9mm M1 carbine replica. Appearance and design aside, their use of aluminum that is impacted by parts made of steel was an unwise decision on their part. I had one that worked fine but was already starting to beat itself to death.

They were told, 1st hand, to stick to the design of a replica M1 carbine. They were well aware of the design of the Iver Johnson replica M1 carbine in 9mm. They were also aware of what happens when you change the design like Universal did with their hybrid carbines.

I told Chiappa and their U.S. president that if they were going to make a replica it should be a replica not a hybrid replica.

In 1942 Inland made several prototypes attempting to eliminate the problems of the GI design slide including a double recoil spring like Universal used on their hybrid. Chiappa side-stepped the work required to make the GI style slide work correctly and this part of their 9mm worked well. The Fail was having a heavy steel slide that impacted their aluminum receiver.

There were other Fails but probably the one that hurt them the most was their design of the magazine well and mag catch. Couldn't believe they cross-bred an AR with an M1 carbine. Knowing how IJ had done so and retained the appearance of a replica. Albeit with an oversized mag catch.

The Iver Johnson 9mm M1 Carbine gets my vote for the best 9mm M1 carbine replica ... so far. The receivers they used were CNC from forged steel by Universal Firearms and not the Universal hybrid design. Wide recoil plate tang too.

I'm not a 9mm fan but as an alternative for less expensive ammo, practice with an M1 carbine design and teaching kids to shoot it gets a thumbs up from me. The 9mm is just a personal preference thing for me.

Jim
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote floydthecat Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Jul 22 2018 at 1:20pm
There are many good 9-mil carbines out there and I have a couple. The one I like the most is the Iver Johnson M1 Carbine in 9MM. I normally would not care for a commercial knock-off but IJ was the only company that manufactured any. They do turn-up on auction sites on occasion for reasonable prices. Numrich still carries a few spare parts and there are only a couple of 9MM specific parts. The trigger housing and it's internals, the stock-group and sights are all USGI compatible. A USGI 30-caliber bolt can be modified for the 9MM rim diameter. The extractor and a magazine-well adapter are 9MM specific.

I reload and shoot the 9 x 19 for like a nickel a round and that's right down there with current 22LR prices. Factory ammo can be had off-the-shelf for $9/box on a routine basis. What's not to like...Big smile
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote David Albert Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Jul 22 2018 at 7:37pm
Originally posted by Carbine Williams Carbine Williams wrote:

I'm hoping to get an M1 Carbine from the Korean War. My Uncle fought in that war. Master Sergeant. He's still alive. 


Carbine Williams,

Please thank your Uncle for his service to our country.

If he's willing, you should try to record as much information about his Korean War service as possible. If he used a Carbine, perhaps he remembers the manufacturer. Some veterans even remember their rifle serial number. If you're looking to purchase a Carbine, you could try to find one from the same manufacturer as he used in the war.

David Albert
dalbert@sturmgewehr.com
NRA Life Member
Past Pres., The American Thompson Association
Amer. Society of Arms Collectors
OGCA/TCA/Carbine Club/GCA/IAA
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Author - The Many Firearm Designs of Eugene Reising
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote jackp1028 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Jul 22 2018 at 8:26pm
Hey Carbine,

My wife's father was among the first U.S. forces to land in Korea after the North Koreans invaded South Korea June 26, 1950. At the time he was stationed in Japan as part of the Occupational forces. His unit, the 27th Infantry Regiment (Wolfhounds), landed in Pusan on July 10 and were the first to engage the enemy on July 18. They saw heavy action throughout the Korean war.

I'm not sure how well trained these initial forces were. As the forward observer for a mortar squad he carried a carbine and did not like it much. He related a story to me that they kept the barrel band screws loose so they could easily field strip it to clean it. He said they didn't always have a screw driver handy. When surprised by attacking North Koreans, he shot one round and the carbine fell apart in his hands. He dropped it and grabbed a Garand. When I asked him if he knew that he could loosen the barrel band screw with the rim of a carbine round he said, "I wondered why it (the screw) was shaped that way." I guess he received no training at all with the carbine. He was one of those with the opinion that the carbine had no stopping power. When he was wounded and had to report to an aid station, they took his carbine away from him. He didn't mind because he thought it would be of little use when he returned to his unit and preferred the Garand even though it was heavier and he couldn't carry as much ammo along with all the mortar gear he had to carry.

A couple of years before he passed away he wrote a 345 page book recounting all his experiences during his time in Korea. They occasionally show up on Amazon.

https://www.amazon.com/Wolfhound-story-Korea-1950-1951/dp/B0006RIDP6

There may be PDF files available online but they're not easy to access.
JackP
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote sleeplessnashadow Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Jul 22 2018 at 10:16pm
Hey Jackp

I have 1 daughter. She married a Wolfhound. They have two little Wolf pups. He does the current Wolfhound newsletter. Thinking I should ask him to run a request for contact for anyone who used the carbine IR scopes in Korea. Like the carbine, used for what it was built for the IR scopes did what they were designed to do And they weren't designed for mountain warfare. Close quarter jungle use.

Daughter met son-in-law on a plane returning to Kuwait enroute Baghdad. She was PSYOP, he was Infantry. Subsequent deployment to Afghanistan Taliban opened up with a recoiless rifle and hit the 40mmm ammo box on top of his MRAP as they were mounting up. 4 went down, 3 returned to duty. Son-in-law was medically discharged as a result. Spine damage. But he has everything still attached and walks upright. Just lifelong degrading spinal damage. Taliban got their wish to meet God. Daughter chose a husband I happen to like a lot.

Jim
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote RClark9595 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Mar 31 2019 at 3:51pm
Jim

Great story, tell your son in-law and daughter thank you for their service, they know first hand what the heavy cost of freedom can be.
Ron

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Vietnam era Vet.
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