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Late QHMC with RSG stock

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sfal7418 View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote sfal7418 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Topic: Late QHMC with RSG stock
    Posted: Jun 18 2018 at 7:32pm
Move this to its own thread as I hope it will aid when someone does a search for info....



more info to follow
Thanks al

Quality Hardware with RSG stock
Sn 4824389
Barrel undated IBM with 2 P proofs first about 5 1/2 in from muzzle 2nd 1 1/2 in below 1st
Bolt tp3 EM-Q right lug, Firing Pin tp3 NL-Q ,extractor tp3  W.Q. ,Ejector plunger tp 3 beveled
Slide tp2 DA-Q In well
Hammer LT-Q (upside down) left side (double strike) 
Trigger LT-Q 
Sear with hole GE-Q
Mag release EP-Q
Safety tp3 smooth both ends unmarked 
Trigger housing tp4 Q-TX
spring tube Q marked on end
Recoil plate RO-Q
Stock RSG and O in slingwell....Quality ORD Wheel right side
Hand guard R.S.G. marked
Butt plate to me looks like a QHMC
Front Sight Brazed unmarked
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kro1970 View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote kro1970 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Jun 18 2018 at 9:56pm
I have QHMC 4836XXX and is almost identical to yours but has a Winchester barrel. The RSG stock has an X stamped in the sling well. It would have been interesting to see the screw that is missing from the barrel band. QHMC type 2 barrel band screw had 3 punch marks on the end of the screw to keep it from coming out.[IMG]uploads/2023/DSC02139_
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painter777 View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote painter777 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Jun 19 2018 at 7:38pm
QHMC 4,8.....
QHMC-CC
RSG and Ovaled O in slingwell




Living Free because of those that serve.....
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sfal7418 View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote sfal7418 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Jun 22 2018 at 5:17pm
also i was wondering about the 2 P proofs on the barrel....is this a norm for these?
Thanks al
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blackfish View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote blackfish Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Jun 22 2018 at 6:48pm
When a barrel was made, its maker may have applied a P if it was proof fired before sending to, say QHMC. Originally all barrels needed proofing but this requirement was later dropped so that only a small fraction of barrels from a manufactured lot were proof fired before assembly into a completed carbine. When the carbine was assembled, the prime contractor proof fired the whole shebang and if it survived, applied their own proof mark to the barrel, bolt and receiver. Thus a small fraction of barrels will bear a double P.

Proof marks of many of the prime contractors are rather unique and can actually identify who used a particular barrel.



In the photo, neither proof appears to my eyes to resemble QHMC's characteristic short-tailed font for their P. Their proof P almost looks like a D. Here's a Winchester barrel, proof fired when made, which was originally assembled into a carbine by QHMC.



So, it might be that the barrel pictured is not original to the carbine, i.e. carbine is an attempted restoration. Or the photo angle may just hide that detail. I can't really say. There are many "original" Rockola's bearing QHMC-proofed Rockola barrels. So pay close attention to those P's!
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sfal7418 View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote sfal7418 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Jun 24 2018 at 10:09am
posted some more pics of barrel and the whole rifle....gun was very dry...no oil ....dust and dirt but got all that cleaned and back together...now just need to find right band screw...

last pic is of 30.06 rd in muzzle....measured out to around .177 .178....hard to do 3 things at once while taking pichappy

Thanks for the help/input
al
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Dan Pinto, Photo Editor

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote New2brass Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Jun 24 2018 at 12:59pm
Originally all barrels for the barrel free issue program were all to be proof fired by the prime contractor.
It was determined that there would be a significant savings on proof ammo if the barrel when installed on a carbine would then be proof fired.

It was something like 100 out of every 1000 barrels produced were to be proof fired. The reason for this was the 10% spares requirement. Barrels that were being shipped to another manufacture would take the 10% that were proofed and wrapped or plainly marked so the it was known that they passed proof firing. Those barrels were to be used to assemble barrel assemblies as "Spares"

At some point the barrels were classified as "Critical" and the spares requirement was dropped to 5% and later brought back up to 10%.  However the missing 5% later had to be made up.

So why 2 proofs on some barrels? Clearly the barrels slated as spares wound up in production as evidence of 2 proofs.
IMHO, if I was managing a plant and weapons were needed for the effort I would ask myself "whats more important" " spares are not immediately needed but weapons are"

So yes an original carbine could have two P proofs. 
Look at CCNLs 199 and 371 for more infoo on requirements as well as the WB series.

So I would say look to CCNL 384 for a list of known P proofs and sizes. The list missed at least one P proof which is discussed here

Is it possible other were missed?

First thing to do is make a good observation if the proofs are the same or different accounting for possible angles the proof was struck.
Second take dome measurements to the 64th of an inch to determine whose proof it is.
Early on I realized the problem "Subjective" measurements especially because I use a caliper to measure to the .001 of an inch. A deeper struck stamp will be larger than a lightly struck.
then you have the masses measuring with whatever, so in 64ths became our standard and the person taking measurements has to average and compensate for missing length of stamp due to stamping at an angle.

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Dan Pinto, Photo Editor

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote New2brass Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Jun 24 2018 at 1:03pm
Originally posted by sfal7418 sfal7418 wrote:

posted some more pics of barrel and the whole rifle....gun was very dry...no oil ....dust and dirt but got all that cleaned and back together...now just need to find right band screw...

last pic is of 30.06 rd in muzzle....measured out to around .177 .178....hard to do 3 things at once while taking pichappy

Thanks for the help/input
al

rotate the bullet in the muzzle to lightly score it. take a measurement at the point or just below to determine ME. .300 to .3005 is like new up to .3025 or .303 is the limit. .308 would have no grooves left Shocked
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sfal7418 View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote sfal7418 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Jun 27 2018 at 4:13pm
N2B....Thanks for the tip....right on the line it was .304....just under line it was .305....assume had calipers in the line for the .304 reading....so not bad...:)


rotate the bullet in the muzzle to lightly score it. take a measurement at the point or just below to determine ME. .300 to .3005 is like new up to .3025 or .303 is the limit. .308 would have no grooves left Shocked

Thanks again
Al
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Dan Pinto, Photo Editor

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote New2brass Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Jun 27 2018 at 10:29pm
For those new to calipers, just zeroing the dial may not give an accurate measurement.
Close the jaws on a piece of paper, pull out paper with enough friction that the paper drags but not rip.
Close jaws and then zero. This way the dirt and dust does not skew the starting point
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