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Information on M1 Carbine magazines

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sling00 View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote sling00 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Dec 26 2017 at 6:20am
Originally posted by He Dog He Dog wrote:

 In looking at his list compared to the Ruth list in WB III there are some differences, mostly having to do with baseplates.  Where Ruth may list a type 3, Lukes shows a type 3 and a type 5.  Some may not consider the difference significant.  As a novice with now a bit over 80 mags, I remain unsure.  
Speaking of the baseplates, I assume that as everything else with carbines the baseplates are interchangeable.  That had me suspicious that some mags very possibly do not have their original baseplate. i.e. Swapped when cleaning, refurbished, etc.  Does anyone have knowledge of this being the case and just how would you go about identifying original baseplates? 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote RClark9595 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Dec 31 2017 at 10:56pm
I am guilty of that, I had a magazine go bad that was causing jamming and couldn't be fixed, before I thew it out I removed it's No, 5 base plate and replaced a No 3 base plate on one of my good mags with it. I suspect others do the same thing so I don't believe you can depend on all base plates being true to the maker of the mag.
Ron

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote sling00 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Jan 01 2018 at 5:50am
Suspicion confirmed! Do you know if a mag is wrapped does that mean it is factory new or could it been through a refurb/repackaged process?

Happy New Year!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote He Dog Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Jan 01 2018 at 10:05am
There were certainly parts interchanged by unit armorers as well as who knows how many times by shooters and collectors, trying to keep mags functioning or correct in the years since the war.
The question I am after is how they where originally issued.  Ruth lists mags with one butt plate type.  Lukes lists two or even three butt plate types on some mags.  If a magazine was early issued with a type two and later a type five was used by the factory, I would consider that a difference.  I am not sure if Mr. Ruth did not consider differing butt plates significant or if perhaps they were only issued with a single butt plate and Mr. Lukes is listing everything he has found rather than how they were originally issued.  I have at least 20 that have butt plates other than listed by Mr. Ruth, but both as shown by Mr. Lukes and some show by neither.  Ah well, life is never simple is it?        
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote jackp1028 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Jan 01 2018 at 11:22am
So far, I have 14 different mags that have come to me in the wax paper wrapping and they all are as noted in WBIII. None appear to have been "refurbished". I've kept them in their original wrappers.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote RClark9595 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Jan 03 2018 at 5:52am
This is one of those things that you just may never know for sure, simply because butt plates and followers are not stamped, (by the way it's not been mentioned about the two types of followers and I don't mean with or without the bolt stop). The best way to get even close to factory issue is by the numbers, if you find 10 WI stamped magazines with 7 type 3 bases, 1 type 2, and 2 type 5 bases. Odds are the type 3 base is correct, another factor to add to that was how were they wrapped, if the wrapping looks good and there is plenty of cosmoline, that adds to the probability they are correct. Keep in mind that latter butt plates as upgrades could have been mandated for use by the government as time went on, so, more than one could be correct sense they're not dated. Just my 2 cents.
Ron

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RClark9595 View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote RClark9595 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Jan 03 2018 at 6:02am
I'm not trying to take the wind out of anybodies sails, but it will be a daunting task at best, maybe Mr Lukes came to realize this and simply gave up? However even daunting tasks are worth doing if the rewards are there. If I were collecting mags, I would stick with what I know, and that is the markings, I'd pay little attention as to what type butt plate it has unless I know for sure which one it should have, because the information just isn't reliable.
Ron

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote sling00 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Jan 03 2018 at 6:35am
Originally posted by RClark9595 RClark9595 wrote:

... If I were collecting mags, I would stick with what I know, and that is the markings, I'd pay little attention as to what type butt plate it has unless I know for sure which one it should have, because the information just isn't reliable.
That's pretty much what I have done. I've only collected about 30 different mfg marks.  I do make note of their base but that isn't my basis for buying one. Similar to the carbine mag pouches. I go with the maker and perhaps different years, but not the different canvas colors and combinations there of.  
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote m1a1fan Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Jan 03 2018 at 9:30pm
Have quite a few mags but not necessarily on purpose. The great Colin mag sale of 15 (I think that was the year) fatteneded up everybody's mag collection. 10 at a time while supplies lasted. Also could ask for custom mag packs by paying a little more. Always like the oddly marked mags and those hard to find.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote He Dog Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Jan 10 2018 at 10:02am
Lukes only lists 15 round mags, most of which were USGI, with others maybe into the Korean War era.  Universals were commercial and later, so are listed only probably only to identify them.  It is possible there are specific Universal collectors that would be interested, but I suspect there is not much premium for one without the 'Japan' mark.  It may be more novel for being a true 10 rounder.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote New2brass Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Jan 10 2018 at 11:54am
Originally posted by sling00 sling00 wrote:

Suspicion confirmed! Do you know if a mag is wrapped does that mean it is factory new or could it been through a refurb/repackaged process?

Happy New Year!
 
Mags as well as other parts were sometimes rewrapped or even repackaged.
If they are parkerized then clearly refurbished. All USGI M1 Carbine mags were blued.
 
I have seen mags with prime contractor name on packaging.
I have also seen boxes marked but do not know if the packages inside are marked.
I have seen mags in cigar paper (or whatever it is called) with mixed manufacture. My guess is this last scenario if from rewrapping.
The question there is were these new and/or lightly used
 
I do not think the military would refurbish and re-blue mags, but not to say others did not.
Mags were cheap to produce and had a life expectancy. The nibs would wear down or shear off. Mags would bend and crush. Cheaper to manufacture more.
 
As to the floor plates, though there are several listed not all manufactures used all of them. some may be typical of one manufacturer.
 
There are some that are even marked which I do not believe was mentioned in the floor plate types. Rather in description.
 
I do collect but not worrying about types, rather more interested in all marking variations.
 
As Mr. Lukes pointed out that the information is ever changing as new marks are found. Sadly he has lost interest.
Good news is we can continue his  (note he mentions the Carbine Club and War Baby) work here. If someone would like to start a database of known and we can figure a system displaying them then we can have input from others.
 
A suggestion might to list alphabetically  by markings then known information. Alternatively to have two groups, one alphabetically then by use of prime contractor.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote He Dog Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Jan 10 2018 at 12:20pm
It would seem that Ruth's War Baby III list would be the place to start.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Charles Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Jan 30 2018 at 11:36am
I have a 5 round mag that is a puzzle to me. It has a last round "bump stay open feature and 30 round 3 notch feature as well. It was defiantly not cut from a larger mag. Can anyone shed any lite on it?
Charles
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