Fake Parts?

What are the most commonly faked parts to be on the lookout for or are they all faked these days?

Yes, definitely barrel bands and rear sights, but I am concerned that these days it may go far beyond that. On ePay there are so many Rock-Ola firing pins and ejectors. I find it hard to believe there are so many available. Bill Ricca doesn't have too much WWII era stuff left. How could others have seemingly so much? Are people faking firing pins ejectors and other less "expensive" parts too? Maybe I am being too paranoid?

Riverbank sells slides "new in crate"

I apologize for my venting of frustration. I am sure this is not new for many of you. I happened to come across this thread on the CMP forum http://forums.thecmp.org/showthread.php?t=29379 and just the thought that some people feel the mentioned publication is an alleged effort by humpers to legitimize their wares made me blow a gasket. I have to stop shopping for junk and buy the CCNLs.

Thank you m1a1fan. Until I fell in love with carbines my collecting passion has been Parker Brothers shotguns. Different world. No fakes at all. Some reproduction butt plates, but those are obvious. About the same number made by Parker as Rock-Ola carbines.  Stepping into carbines and Garands has been an eye opener. I may sound a bit naïve, but I would characterize myself more as disappointed. That has not affected my appreciation of the carbine, or of this particular community. You all and what you do are a light in the darkness.

Reproduction firearm item awareness is something that I'm fairly passionate about. In case you have not seen it, here is a link to a lecture I presented in 2010 to The American Thompson Association about reproduction Thompson accessories, which includes some coverage of other firearm genres. You will not find much in the way of formal coverage of reproduction firearm items in printed form, or on the internet. Most examples are covered in discussion topics on forums like this. There is one book that exists, but it mostly covers pre-20th century firearms. The lecture presentation linked below also includes a Thompson reproduction item standard that we adopted as a collector club, which is available for other clubs to use as they see fit.

http://www.sturmgewehr.com/dalbert/TATA/2010/Repro%20Lecture%202010.pdf

Here is another pinned topic on the subject:

http://www.machinegunboards.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=12358

Here is my main advice:

1. Be careful - Some fakers are out there with a profit motive on major transactions
2. Do not accept the terms "always" or "never" when used in Carbine collecting
3. Keep an open mind - Carbine experts exist (although this trait is not limited to Carbine experts) who have observed hundreds of examples of what "right" looks like - However, their opinions were formed based on the majority trait being the only correct trait - This conclusion is made without a general understanding of manufacturing quality principles - Exceptions occur in any manufacturing process - That being said, exceptions should be few, and should have the "5 Whys" principle applied to them (This dovetails with #2 above) - These statements should not be construed as a recommendation to disregard expert opinions - Just to "keep an open mind," as I stated to begin with
4. The current Carbine Club policy states, "If a person wants to restore a gun to its original configuration, refinish the metal or wood, fill in rear sight staking marks, re-stamp a stock, or use reproduction parts, that is his private business as long as that gun is for his own collection. It is dishonest to later sell or trade such a gun, without full disclosure of all the restoration that was done." This is a well intended rule, but it is inherently flawed, considering the fact that we are temporary custodians of these Carbines - Our widows will not know a thing about what "private business" was done to a Carbine, and the estate asset of the deceased will flow into the collector community for immediate sale - The only caveat to this is if the Carbine's modification was noted on a Carbine Data Sheet, but that will likely not be available for consideration at the time of sale

David Albert
dalbert@sturmgewehr.com

eestes wrote: Thanks David. The presentation you shared was outstanding. It sure would be nice to see similar information for the carbine, although I have heard some opinions that clear documentation online of fake vs. real will only allow the fakers to better their products. Catch 22. Great advice from all posters. Thank you.

Thanks for your kind words about the Thompson presentation.

Yes, the train of thought certainly exists that documenting fakes makes the fakers fake better. I've encountered it many times in different firearm genres, with it being most prevalent among Carbine collectors. I respect that opinion, though my own opinion is that documenting fakes is the right thing to do for current and future collectors.

David Albert
dalbert@sturmgewehr.com

Sling00, I recommend reading 366-367 first. Then to end making notes when it references earlier newsletters. Then go start at beginning. This is due to early on there was info that was not yet discovered.

Learn what is best info first, then the minutia

Yep, the NL's are overwhelming.  That is a lot of information.  I appreciate the suggestions on getting through them and by the way I do have a copy of the index.