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Carbine Club Datasheet Question

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m1a1fan View Drop Down
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    Posted: Apr 24 2017 at 6:01pm
I have the newly updated CCDS and I'm hoping the experts can help me fill it out. On page two I'm not sure where to look to answer the following questions:

Receiver firing pin cut
Extra cut on the bottom of the receiver

Thanks!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote sling00 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Apr 24 2017 at 7:18pm
Originally posted by m1a1fan m1a1fan wrote:

Receiver firing pin cut

Looks like this may be the "Firing pin mating cut" and "retracting cam" shown in NL 341-3?

It also discusses "no cut" and "cut" on that same page.  Perhaps the "extra cut" referred to on the CCDS?

Personally I didn't even attempt page 2. Is the CCDS you have the 01-01-11 revision or is there a newer one somewhere?

Thanks
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote RedSpecial Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Apr 24 2017 at 8:15pm
I didn't know there was a page two...
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote m1a1fan Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Apr 24 2017 at 8:51pm
@sling - Thanks, I'll check those out. This is my first attempt at page 2. The datasheet was updated recently to include an additional page courtesy of newscotlander. It is optional but provides additional information for collectors. I normally use the back of the datasheet to fill in things like which parts are blued, parked, etc... and the additional page makes it much easier and is well formatted.

@Red - Check the link and you will see there are now two pages for the DS

http://uscarbinecal30.com/forum/uploads/4/CC_-_DataSheet_rev4__1-1-11.pdf
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Lupus Dei Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Apr 24 2017 at 8:59pm
Page two was a recent addition that was made by Chris Albright for his own use. We thought it useful due to adding things such as  blued/park/white for certain parts.
 
the firing pin cut can be sort of seen here
 
 
Sounds like a good task for someone to make a tutorial for page two!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote m1a1fan Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Apr 24 2017 at 9:43pm
Thanks Lupus.. I'll volunteer to make a tutorial once I'm finished writing some potential articles for the club.

So little to do, so much time.....Strike that, reverse it...carry on.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote NewScotlander Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Apr 25 2017 at 5:34pm
Sorry for the confusion on this. As previously stated, I made page two for my own use and abbreviated some things. The "receiver firing pin cut" is technically referred to as the "firing pin retracting cam mating cut" in TM 9-1276. Below is the article in NL341.



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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote m1a1fan Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Apr 25 2017 at 6:12pm
Thanks newscotlander.

No confusions, just more data for collector's to note, document and learn about. Thinking I might update the form again to include some type of "scratch pad" for miscellaneous information.

The amount of information about carbines can be overwhelming at times, but that is a good thing.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote W5USMC Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Jun 20 2017 at 11:12pm
So I have now completed three data sheets, on my Rockola my S'G' and my Inland, I even almost completed page 2.  Which led me to this post about the firing pin cut and the extra cut on the bottom of the receiver.  Only issue I am having is telling the difference between 33 degree and 45 degree on the firing pin mating cuts, not really sure how to measure

First picture is my Rockola which I believe to be a 33 degree cut?
 

The second pic is my S'G' which I think is a 45 degree cut?


The 3rd pic is my Inland which I think is a 33 degree cut?


Am I correct in what I am thinking or are they all the same cuts??  All three have the extra cut on the bottom of the receiver.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote W5USMC Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Jun 23 2017 at 4:03pm
And here is a pic of my winchester, no extra cut on the bottom of the receiver. I am still having trouble deciding between 33 and 45 degrees for the firing pin mating cut.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote m1a1fan Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Jun 23 2017 at 6:33pm
Hard to tell for sure, but think you cut assessment is correct.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote sling00 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Jun 23 2017 at 8:21pm
I "guess-timate" by the symmetry of the cam cut-out.  If they look pretty even on both side then 45.  If noticeably longer on one side then its a 33.  I'll look for a small clear plastic protractor and see if that helps.    
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote sling00 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Jun 24 2017 at 9:31am
I haven't found any definitive reference to what the cam angle is referenced so my guess is perpendicular to the bolt.  Drawing a line that best fit the curve of the cutout on the eject side of the receiver, with a cheap plastic protractor I measured amazingly close to the listed 45 and 33 degrees.

???


 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote W5USMC Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Jun 24 2017 at 9:39am
Thanks sling00, that was a great help. I have a protractor but I was not sure where I was supposed to be holding it to get the measurement.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote sling00 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Jun 24 2017 at 10:57am
Like I said that is my best "guess-timate" for point of reference and I welcome any better answer.  Using my protractor looks like all yours, including the S'G' are 33s? Note your pic of the S'G' is at a slight angle which slightly skews the actual angle.  However keep in mind that's me trying to hold a straight edge and protractor on a swiveling monitor.     
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote jackp1028 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Jun 24 2017 at 10:59am
Does anyone have access to the original engineering drawings for the receiver? What does that show? I've only seen detail dimension drawings for the Type 6 TH, Type 5 slide and Type 4 stock.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote New2brass Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Jun 24 2017 at 11:39am
Just a thought, as I have not checked. It the 33 and 45 in relation to the bolt position? Meaning the degree of rotation before the firing pin is allowed to start to move forward.
Looking at an early Underwood the cam cut is long.  A 5 mill Inland it is an abrupt cutout. If you hold the FP in and slide bolt you will see how it prevents firing pin from slam firing until it is locked in place. earlier receiver may allow slam fire.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote m1a1fan Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Jun 24 2017 at 5:22pm
That's the part I don't get. I see the arrows, but I'm not sure where to measure the angle.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote floydthecat Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Jun 24 2017 at 7:26pm
Originally posted by m1a1fan m1a1fan wrote:

That's the part I don't get. I see the arrows, but I'm not sure where to measure the angle.


New2brass is suggesting it's not the angle of the cut in the bridge, it's "degrees of rotation" of the bolt. To me...it means they altered the point at which the FP becomes blocked by the bridge. The point at which this occurs depends on the slope and shape of that notch.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote m1a1fan Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Jun 24 2017 at 7:48pm
Ok, thanks. Didn't see sling00 got out the protractor and edited the picture. Makes sense now.
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