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New to me carbine

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metalwrkr View Drop Down
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    Posted: Aug 24 2022 at 2:01pm
Recently purchased this carbine from a friend.  Barrel is stamped UNDERWOOD 8-43 with a flaming bomb below it.  The receiver is stamped QUALITY HMC and the serial number is within the second block of numbers given to Quality Hardware.  It appears to have the newest gradient type sights, lever safety. Wide stock band and bayonet holder.  The clip that came with it  was an aftermarket 5 shot unit.  I had some other clips from my Fathers old gear.  The stock is a lightly sporterized 4 rivet, low wood potbelly type.  I have not separated stock and barrel yet.  There is an original M1 manual and armory parts list brochure.  Also a bayonet and rifle case.  There is a metal box stamped US with a bunch of parts, springs and cleaning rod as well as a wrench of some type and two other tools.  A gunsmith friend of mine has evaluated this as an original WW2 carbine that has been armory reworked and later released into civilian hands, either to a commercial sporterizing house or private party who sporterized it.  I would appreciate any insights or observations on this rifle. It certainly shoots well as two 50yd 5 shot groups attest.  Thanks for any comments
Old and worn out. I have two speeds, dead slow and all stop. Sent from my rotary phone!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Rebel92 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Aug 24 2022 at 2:33pm
I see a couple of sears, I think a firing pin, recoil spring, recoil spring guide, and a gas piston nut wrench in your spare parts box. I also think i see a couple of the spare recoil spring tubes, which would make sense being that yours is a Quality Hardware (QHMC) and they used that style of receiver all throughout their production! I am Sure there are other parts I cannot see. 




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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote W5USMC Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Aug 24 2022 at 4:44pm
Good looking carbine. Any markings in the sling well of the stock? The stock does not appear to be a "potbelly" looks like a type III, possibly a type II in earlier life. How about the bayonet markings?

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Matt_X Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Aug 24 2022 at 6:01pm
I'd be interested in knowing what manuals you have there too. The reprints I've seen are not complete - missing a lot of the interesting stuff about training.  So I'd say your paperwork has historical value as well.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote metalwrkr Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Aug 24 2022 at 7:46pm
Originally posted by Rebel92 Rebel92 wrote:

I see a couple of sears, I think a firing pin, recoil spring, recoil spring guide, and a gas piston nut wrench in your spare parts box. I also think i see a couple of the spare recoil spring tubes, which would make sense being that yours is a Quality Hardware (QHMC) and they used that style of receiver all throughout their production! I am Sure there are other parts I cannot see. 





Hey Rebel,  Here is a picture of the box contents.  Might be easier to see.  Thanks for your info!
Old and worn out. I have two speeds, dead slow and all stop. Sent from my rotary phone!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote metalwrkr Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Aug 24 2022 at 8:04pm
Originally posted by W5USMC W5USMC wrote:

Good looking carbine. Any markings in the sling well of the stock? The stock does not appear to be a "potbelly" looks like a type III, possibly a type II in earlier life. How about the bayonet markings?

Hey W5USMC, thanks for replying.  No doubt you are right.  I am still not versed in the stock subtleties. Here are some pictures of the stock well and bayonet.
Old and worn out. I have two speeds, dead slow and all stop. Sent from my rotary phone!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Quietus Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Aug 24 2022 at 8:31pm
One of the sears is for a M1911 pistol (below the recoil spring, left of the extractor.)
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote W5USMC Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Aug 24 2022 at 9:05pm
Nice stock, too bad someone thought it needed that recoil pad. Are there any markings on the right side of the stock?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote metalwrkr Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Aug 24 2022 at 9:10pm
Originally posted by Matt_X Matt_X wrote:

I'd be interested in knowing what manuals you have there too. The reprints I've seen are not complete - missing a lot of the interesting stuff about training.  So I'd say your paperwork has historical value as well.

Here are some pictures of the manuals and other items.  The manual has what appears to be an addenda of several pages stapled to the front cover.  I can't read what is on the sling.  The scabbard looks legit and it appears as if maybe someone purchased it at an Army Navy store for $1.98. Go figure!
Old and worn out. I have two speeds, dead slow and all stop. Sent from my rotary phone!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote GotSnlB28 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Aug 24 2022 at 10:03pm
Rarer manufacturer of your canvas carrying case - well worth the $1.98 Lol. Nice bayonet and c-tip sling too.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Why Carbines? Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Aug 25 2022 at 8:28am
An eclectic group of cool items.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Matt_X Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Aug 25 2022 at 1:59pm
The addenda in the field manual is Change 4 (19 August 1946) to the April 1944 edition.
You may find the earlier changes attached there as well.
The existance of those changes is listed here http://www.uscarbinecal30.com/books.html But I'm not aware of a description of those changes.


ORD 7 B-28 Organizational Spare Parts and Equipment
I'm not seeing a 5 November 1945 edition listed on either the club webpage above or David Albert's list.  
It might be useful for identifying changes or continued us of spare parts and accessories.
For example in you collection there is a thong for cleaning.
We've seen those in individual soldier carbine accessory packs from the 1950s, but its possible they were being issued earlier than that. 



Originally posted by metalwrkr metalwrkr wrote:


Here are some pictures of the manuals and other items.  The manual has what appears to be an addenda of several pages stapled to the front cover.  I can't read what is on the sling.  The scabbard looks legit and it appears as if maybe someone purchased it at an Army Navy store for $1.98. Go figure!


Sling markings are often difficult to read, and not all were marked.
Some are marked MRT for Mildew Resistant Treatment, whcih I think is post WW2.
Yours looks to be a manufacturer's mark.

Follow this link

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote metalwrkr Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Aug 25 2022 at 4:43pm
Originally posted by Matt_X Matt_X wrote:

The addenda in the field manual is Change 4 (19 August 1946) to the April 1944 edition.
You may find the earlier changes attached there as well.
The existance of those changes is listed here http://www.uscarbinecal30.com/books.html But I'm not aware of a description of those changes.


ORD 7 B-28 Organizational Spare Parts and Equipment
I'm not seeing a 5 November 1945 edition listed on either the club webpage above or David Albert's list.  
It might be useful for identifying changes or continued us of spare parts and accessories.
For example in you collection there is a thong for cleaning.
We've seen those in individual soldier carbine accessory packs from the 1950s, but its possible they were being issued earlier than that. 


Originally posted by metalwrkr metalwrkr wrote:


Here are some pictures of the manuals and other items.  The manual has what appears to be an addenda of several pages stapled to the front cover.  I can't read what is on the sling.  The scabbard looks legit and it appears as if maybe someone purchased it at an Army Navy store for $1.98. Go figure!

Sling markings are often difficult to read, and not all were marked.
Some are marked MRT for Mildew Resistant Treatment, whcih I think is post WW2.
Yours looks to be a manufacturer's mark.

Follow this link

Hey Matt_X,  Thanks for the info.  I will follow up on the links.  The cleaning thong and jags all go into the silver tube which has an oiler at the other end (but I guess you know all this).  I think there is a small tube or rod that is missing from the oiler cap.  It might have come off in the oil itself and be glued in there.  I will have to check.


Old and worn out. I have two speeds, dead slow and all stop. Sent from my rotary phone!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote W5USMC Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Aug 25 2022 at 5:32pm
Originally posted by Quietus Quietus wrote:

One of the sears is for a M1911 pistol (below the recoil spring, left of the extractor.)

And the part pictured to the right of the trigger spring is a M1911 Disconnector.
The oiler and contents were originally issued for the M1903
The tool marked US is a M1903 Combination tool.

The sling looks to be marked SM Co 194?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote metalwrkr Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Aug 25 2022 at 7:44pm
Good eye on the sear!  I would have never recognized it.
Old and worn out. I have two speeds, dead slow and all stop. Sent from my rotary phone!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote metalwrkr Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Aug 25 2022 at 7:52pm
Originally posted by W5USMC W5USMC wrote:

Nice stock, too bad someone thought it needed that recoil pad. Are there any markings on the right side of the stock?
No markings on the right side.  Is there any significance of the sling well inscription?
Old and worn out. I have two speeds, dead slow and all stop. Sent from my rotary phone!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote W5USMC Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Aug 25 2022 at 8:00pm
Q RMC = stock was made by Rock-Ola Mfg Co. for Quality Hardware
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote metalwrkr Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Aug 26 2022 at 2:25pm
Originally posted by W5USMC W5USMC wrote:

Q RMC = stock was made by Rock-Ola Mfg Co. for Quality Hardware

Looks like this carbine is a real "Dukes Mix"! Oh well, She shoots.  All I was after!
Old and worn out. I have two speeds, dead slow and all stop. Sent from my rotary phone!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Matt_X Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Aug 26 2022 at 3:33pm
Originally posted by metalwrkr metalwrkr wrote:

Originally posted by W5USMC W5USMC wrote:

Q RMC = stock was made by Rock-Ola Mfg Co. for Quality Hardware

Looks like this carbine is a real "Dukes Mix"! Oh well, She shoots.  All I was after!


Considering its a Q.H. receiver, having a stock made for Quality is a good match.
I think it may have been mentioned that no manufacturer made all of the parts in-house.  Rockola had the capacity and ability to make stocks for some of the other manufacturers.
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